Wittols are a Bull's Best Friend

[Dblinsey]

The English language, like every other language is constantly evolving to embrace emerging trends and environments.

Since we started down this lifestyle path, we have referred to ourselves as being in a Stag/Vixen relationship; whereas I have (in my case) Black lovers and my husband supports my interests.

Apparently another term for this is 'Wittol' but I don't know the origin of the term, nor have I every heard of it, leading me to wonder if it's older than the introduction of the 'Stag/Vixen' term or a recent development.

Proceeding down this thread about the evolution of language, I would offer that the very term 'cuckold' has evolved as well. For example, the origin of the word was derogatory in that a wife had slept around behind the husbands back. For the longest time, it continued to be viewed in a negative context until perhaps the turn of the century and the increasing use of the internet.

While the four definitions in the first post in this thread are accurate, they also illustrate this division, and you see it on this site every day.

No doubt that while there are a substantial amount of couples who embrace the humiliation aspect the term implies, there is a growing number of couples who fall into the Stag/Vixen (Wittol) category. They, like ourselves, don't like the humiliation aspect, rejecting it out of hand.

I would hope that the division becomes much more apparent, with 'cuckold' being used to describe the humiliation of the husband, with perhaps 'wittol' being used to describe the support by the husband.

Just my take on the topic, but an interesting side note... When I used 'Wittol' in this response, it did not come up as a misspelled word! So at least the computer dictionary is aware of the term!

Donna

 

[hungteacher]

*raises hand to volunteer*

Do you have experience? Id love to connect

 

[hungteacher]

I've been ENM/poly my whole adult life and have had a cuckold/hotwife fetish pretty much from the beginning. I pretty much grew up on IR porn, have shared past partners with other men, served as a fluffer/fucklicking/cleanup/etc. I'm pansexual, but not panromantic, so while I'd be thrilled to have an alpha to serve sexually, it would only be a physical/dominance/submission thing, no chance of me catching feelings beyond friendship.

With respect to cuckolding, I've got a very creative imagination, and a lot of things I've wanted to try, but not enough partners/opportunities to try them all.

For a while, I've thought that it might be ideal to find an alpha BBC I could serve, where I would be like an educational tool for him to teach young, less experienced women how to submit to alphas and dominate/cuckold betas. So I'd be helping to coordinate dates where he would get to do all the things, and I'd be in chastity watching, serving, and making sure none of his cum ever went to waste and that mine only ever stayed locked up or got wasted. It would be a symbiotic relationship, where my goal would be for him to get as much pussy as possible and where my reward would be to get to clean up all the pussy I was denied. Together we'd be helping more women to learn the joy of a lifestyle they might otherwise not have discovered (and various actual skills to go along with it (pegging, tease & denial, ruined orgasms, dirty talk, etc), which could create ongoing opportunities for him, and for other men those women would go on to date romantically.

Definitely message me if you have any ideas along these lines.

That is really funny you said all of that.

I had a cuckold assistant back in Jersey who did exactly what you described. The woman 25yr old Slut from OR, introduced me to him and he was my personal cuckold assistant for about 4 months before he had an emotional breakdown. Not to go into too many details, but he claimed he had 3 previous LTR relationships before he confessed he needed to be a cuckold. The last gf, broke up with him because she had no idea what he was talking about. And after meeting and getting to know him as a friend, I have to say "He had no idea what he was doing"
Anyway, he stopped dating for 2 years and I think the only women he spoke to were at work. Then he came to one of my events in Manhattan, and from there we got along really well and I asked if he wanted the assistant role. He agreed. Which always shocks me, because most cuckold wannabes I run into are 1000% selfish and self-centered and hate to help people other than themselves.
Anyway, within 5 weeks, I had introduced him to 10 women. I ended up fucking 4 of them. And he could not handle keeping up with all the text messages from 10 women. He was beyond overwhelmed.
So I said, that would could cut it down to just the 4 that I was having sex with. He agreed, at first, but about a month later, he told me again that he was so overwhelmed. He couldn't manage work life and cuckold life.
So I am always very hesitant to have new cuckolds be my assistant because most men, in general, are about as smart as a pet rock, and also have the emotional maturity of a toddler.
This LS requires EQ and the ability to self-manage as well as be empathetic to women's needs and wants.
Its been the biggest disappointment about this LS that there are not enough men who have the capacity of being a cuckold, because I know a lot of women that would like to try dating one.

 

[hungteacher]

Yeah, so I think it's really important for anyone that they're able to understand their limits and set expectations appropriately. Boundaries are also important -obviously time management as well.

From a poly perspective, I wouldn't say I've actively dated more than 3 women simultaneously, though I like to stay on good terms with past partners, so even while maintaining 3 relationships, I'm still corresponding with past partners. Then there's also the casual time spent looking for new people who it might make sense to add to the mix. I've had times when I was single where I've gone on 10 first dates in a week, and although it sounds exciting to guys who haven't done it, once you have, you don't want to do it again. It can be time consuming, exhausting, expensive, and complicated. Without clear boundaries that are well enforced, it is easy to get polysaturated.

If you had the expectation that the cuckold assistant was going to maintain 10 full-time relationships with women you were fucking, that's probably beyond polysaturation for most humans, since we've only got 24 hours in each day, and most of us spend about 16 or more of that sleeping and working. Especially if you go from 0 relationships to 10 all at once. But if the expectation is more that these are casual relationships, where the women are primarily interested in using you for mindblowing sex, and the cuck is there to help coordinate for you, that seems more achievable.

So for example, a therapist probably has way more than 10 clients, but they set boundaries around their time. You schedule appointments, weekly/bi-weekly/monthly/etc. You can contact them between the appointments if there's some kind of emergency, or you need to reschedule, but they're not going to give you therapy outside of therapy. A personal trainer would be another example. They probably have more than 10 clients, but they're only going to train during their appointments.

The wittol is like a secretary, there to schedule the appointments, and to serve as a participant in them. The benefit to the women who keep their appointments is mindblowing sex, and free training about how to dominate/cuckold men. The benefit to the alpha is having someone to coordinate their sex life, to keep their balls drained. The benefit of the wittol is being able to watch, serve, cleanup, and be objectified by the alpha and the women who are learning to dominate/cuckold him.

Also, if the cuck is expected to be fully responsible for attracting/seducing these women, then handing them off to the alpha -that would increase the difficulty by an order of magnitude for multiple reasons. I've dated women who I tried to get interested in cuckold/hotwife roleplay, but they have hangups on who the guy is, what he's like outside the bedroom, all this stuff that ultimately won't matter if the overall goal is for him to show up, give them mindblowing sex and leave. Some get offended by the mere idea of it, because in a way, the cuckold is objectifying their woman and turning her out like a free whore. So it seems like it would have to be the clear expectation going in that this is specifically the purpose of them even talking to me. Also, in my view, if the alpha is jacked and hung, and looks good in his profile pics, and you're able to create a profile with pics of him and the cuck together, then it ought to simplify things for the pre-date coord for the cuck on some level. It's likely that the aesthetic of the alpha would be getting more attention/interest than that of the cuck alone. I have female friends who have opened tinder to show me the thousands of "likes," matches and messages they get. One described it as "swatting dicks away with a baseball bat." So I understand that competition is fierce, and that you've really got to be offering a special, stand-out experience if you want to get anywhere.

I feel like probably a lot of women have MFM/MMF fantasies, so if you're able to check that "bucket list" item off for them, they'd jump at the opportunity. It's a sort of marketing/sales exercise, really. What does the market demand, which niches are overloaded and which are under-served? Then there's the human psychology aspect of it. There are probably tons of women who would love to be in a hotwife/cuck relationship, but they aren't attracted to subby guys or betas, which means that for it to happen, they either need to date an alpha and break him into a beta, or they need to find a beta who is good enough at faking the alpha demeanor to establish the relationship in the first place. But if you're offering a dynamic where women can get both sides of that dynamic from day 1, and explore it in a fun/casual/low commitment way, that seems like it would be appealing.

Anyway, if I could find an alpha in my area who wanted to explore this kind of dynamic with me and we could collaborate on getting him lots of pussy to fill up for me to lick clean, that would be pretty great.

Thank you for posting this reply.

I hope more cuckolds can see this, if you can tag more people, I think it would be very helpful.

You are correct, it is not possible to maintain 10 relationships with people, but that was not the expectation at all. In fact, I made it clear to him from the beginning that I wanted him to check in once a day for 60 minutes. That was my clear directive. I set up a group chat on Snapchat and I just wanted him to check in, read all the messages for that day and then make a few replies and then log off and continue with his day.

I made it clear that if he liked any of the women, he could message them directly and begin a friendship or more, if he wished. But he had 10 women to talk to and decide if he liked any, instead of 0.

I basically did all the work of creating a social life for him, and only wanted him to start slow. 60 minutes a day.

He got OVERLY excited by the NEWNESS and the over stimulation. And he went overboard. He didn't listen to me. He also didn't tell me, until he was overwhelmed. So I asked him? are you spending 60 minutes a day? And his response was CLASSIC cuckold - No, I am checking my phone when I get a message and I am responding. So I am trying to spend about 60 minutes a day.

Here is TIME MANAGEMENT TIP #1
There is no such thing as checking in multiple times per day on your phone. You need to set aside specific phone times, email times, follow up times. And block out time for each.

So I wanted him to check ONCE A DAY on Snapchat. And spend 60 full minutes, just focusing on the messages and what was said and any replies. There were 10 women, so in a day there could be 20-30 messages. It would take about 20 minutes to read and catch up and maybe another 20 minutes to follow up. And then he could spend 10-20 minutes talking directly with women that he liked.

This was VERY DOABLE. I was shouldering all the heavy load and responsibility, I just needed someone to assist and help.

He didn't listen. He didnt' follow instructions and he didnt set up his OWN limits and boundaries.
So he violated himself. And the result was having an emotional breakdown.

I see it ALL THE TIME!!

I hope you will make a comment over on the Social Network post by @Neilson
you would make a great add on to the community

 

[RandC]

I saw the word "wittol" used in an on-line story or news article recently. The context in which it was used left little doubt as to its intended meaning but I checked my desk top dictionary anyway. Pulling a blank with a Webster's wanna be, I Googled it. What an education!

First off, I discovered it names my affliction of many years. Been there, done that. Didn't know it had a name. It also nails down a common pastime of a large number of very happy people in our world. Defined, it loosely means husbands who enjoy letting other men fuck their wives.

It seems that the word "cuckold", an old and well used term, has several facets. Some nice, some not so much. Some forms are delightful, some destructive.

The four kinds of cuckolds are: (1) Husbands of wives that have lovers but know nothing of her actions. (2) Husbands who find out their wives have lovers and hit the ceiling. (3) Husbands who tolerate their wives dalliances for some reason but don't like it at all. (4) Husbands who like, even promote, their wives being with other men sexually.

In the first type, as long as the conditions are stable, i.e., hubby never finds out, all is well and good. This type may continue for all of their married lives and never cause any problem. A sort of "Ignorance is Bliss" or "What you don't know, can't hurt you" situation. I suspect this type is way more common than any statistic on successful marriages will ever reveal. Unfortunately, type (1) often suddenly becomes type (2) or (3) with unhappy results.

The second type is the dangerous one. For the wife and/or her lover, and anyone else within range. This cuckold type is not likely to have a happy ending for either of the participants, the willing or the deceived. Jealous rage by a wronged husband is not justification for mayhem in any modern court of law. Divorce, alimony, baby support and long prison terms, are all just minor implications associated with this cuckold type.

I find the third type to be the saddest of all. The long suffering wimp that knows what his wife, and the mom of his *******, is doing in her spare time and just barely tolerates it. He doesn't like it, it offends his manhood, he is humiliated in several ways, but he sticks with her. Their wedding vows may not mean much to her but they do to him. It may be the *******, it may be the mortgage, it may be his place in his social circle. Regardless of reason, he watches her go out at night and takes her back when she returns. The poor bastard may eventually either ******* himself to death or stick the shotgun in his mouth.

Then we come to the fourth type, the wittol. Here's the guy that likes, no loves, that his wife is open and forthright enough in her sexuality to indulge herself with other men. This is the guy that encourages his bride to seek out other men or at least to eagerly accept the ones he brings to her. A wittol is exactly the sort of husband that any self respecting man on the prowl for pussy should be searching out and cultivating.

Let's call him a Bull. It's a well deserved moniker for the kind of guy that most couples find most desirable when opening up the master bedroom door to include another man. He's reasonably polished. He's physically clean and capable. He's equipped and competent in the bedroom. And he's respectful of the marriage bond between the couple. You can call him a stud, a player. You may even call him your best friend. He's going to be a very important part of your lives forever, if only in fond memories.

Any way you cut it, the Bull and the wittol are a team. One compliments the other. Any Bull that goes into a cuckold (1), (2) or (3) scenario has to watch his back. His welfare, perhaps his very survival, is always hanging out there. One slip-up and the wet rumpled sheets could turn into a chalk outline on a bedroom floor. But if he teams up with a wittol, he's home free. Not only is most of his prep work done, the girl of his dreams comes gift wrapped. She has a place to stay, paid for. She has a car, paid for. She has a built in baby sitter if necessary. This lucky Bull doesn't have to worry about alibis, hidden emails, or leaving hickeys in nice places.

Every Bull worth his salt should seek out and foster wittols. They are his gateway to paradise. They will cover his back and his tracks, and pick up the tab. All he has to do is treat their wives right. Take care of them in the sack, let him watch once in a while, and maybe take a picture or two to jerk off to later. He doesn't have to abuse the wittol if the wittol doesn't want it. He should respect him, buy him a birthday gift, laugh at his jokes, appreciate what the wittol is giving him . He's the guy that's setting the Bull up with some mighty fine pussy. The wittol is the guy that meets you at the door and hangs up your coat while his wife is unzipping your pants.

So here we are. The wittol gets what he wants. The Bull gets what he wants. And the wife, the center of our attention, gets twice what she wants. She gets an adoring husband and provider and she also gets the excitement of an outside love interest without any complication or subterfuge. She probably won't tell her mom that she has found the secret to wedded bliss but I wouldn't bet that she doesn't tell her daughters. Secrets like this are too good to keep.

My hubby is a wittol too!!

 

[Houn Dawg]

My hubby is a wittol too!!

A very happy one, too, from the looks of it.

 

[Shecuckedme]

My wife made me a cuckold by having an affair but I’m now a wittol!

 

[hungteacher]

My wife made me a cuckold by having an affair but I’m now a wittol!

Good boy

 

[hungteacher]

Call me whatever you want, The title doesn’t matter to me.
I just love to see my sexy wife lose herself in orgasmic ******* on a big dicked bull right before he dumps his load of cum as deep as he can in her.

I love seeing her forget her marital vows, the worries of daily life, the stress.
She becomes a mindless slut submitting to a bull it’s the hottest thing imaginable.

You see, I’m capable of satisfying her myself
But after I’ve cum, For the next week I feel tired, docile, unmotivated, lethargic until my balls are full again.

Then I feel like I can conquer the world, The highs and lows of sex and recovery.

How can I maintain that [high] Indefinitely without my wife becoming frustrated? Straying in secret? God forbid she cheat on me with a weaker male out of desperation, That would be the ultimate shame.

The simple solution is [hotwifing]
I have the power to choose high quality men to satisfy my wife for me, Lesser white guys ew gross, I’d be insulted if my wife cheated with another white guy.

But black men, strong, muscular, handsome, powerful mindsets, the swagger and confidence.
They have it all.

That’s who I want my wife to make love to.

I see black men as my equal they are more than capable of filling my shoes [and wife] in the bedroom, ther white guys are weak, their genitals are short and thin, balls are tiny and laughable, their voices shrill and high pitched.

I love the feeling of edging and not cumming at all, being [full] and frustrated.
The surge of testosterone accompanied with it, The mental focus, the deeper voice.

Confidence in the workplace, The promotions and the praise from

Nature has made a cruel trick, look up cuckholding and [sperm competition]

This is what I’m into, The build up and semen retention but 10X with cuckholding.

Thank you for adding to the thread. That was interesting to say the least.

Kind of lost me when you started to talk about black men v white men. It kind of went into a little bit of fantasy land talk, but I was really happy to read that you love your wife and feel she deserves to be satisfied and happy. And thats what this is all about

 

[filthyNflorida]

I saw the word "wittol" used in an on-line story or news article recently. The context in which it was used left little doubt as to its intended meaning but I checked my desk top dictionary anyway. Pulling a blank with a Webster's wanna be, I Googled it. What an education!

First off, I discovered it names my affliction of many years. Been there, done that. Didn't know it had a name. It also nails down a common pastime of a large number of very happy people in our world. Defined, it loosely means husbands who enjoy letting other men fuck their wives.

It seems that the word "cuckold", an old and well used term, has several facets. Some nice, some not so much. Some forms are delightful, some destructive.

The four kinds of cuckolds are: (1) Husbands of wives that have lovers but know nothing of her actions. (2) Husbands who find out their wives have lovers and hit the ceiling. (3) Husbands who tolerate their wives dalliances for some reason but don't like it at all. (4) Husbands who like, even promote, their wives being with other men sexually.

In the first type, as long as the conditions are stable, i.e., hubby never finds out, all is well and good. This type may continue for all of their married lives and never cause any problem. A sort of "Ignorance is Bliss" or "What you don't know, can't hurt you" situation. I suspect this type is way more common than any statistic on successful marriages will ever reveal. Unfortunately, type (1) often suddenly becomes type (2) or (3) with unhappy results.

The second type is the dangerous one. For the wife and/or her lover, and anyone else within range. This cuckold type is not likely to have a happy ending for either of the participants, the willing or the deceived. Jealous rage by a wronged husband is not justification for mayhem in any modern court of law. Divorce, alimony, baby support and long prison terms, are all just minor implications associated with this cuckold type.

I find the third type to be the saddest of all. The long suffering wimp that knows what his wife, and the mom of his *******, is doing in her spare time and just barely tolerates it. He doesn't like it, it offends his manhood, he is humiliated in several ways, but he sticks with her. Their wedding vows may not mean much to her but they do to him. It may be the *******, it may be the mortgage, it may be his place in his social circle. Regardless of reason, he watches her go out at night and takes her back when she returns. The poor bastard may eventually either ******* himself to death or stick the shotgun in his mouth.

Then we come to the fourth type, the wittol. Here's the guy that likes, no loves, that his wife is open and forthright enough in her sexuality to indulge herself with other men. This is the guy that encourages his bride to seek out other men or at least to eagerly accept the ones he brings to her. A wittol is exactly the sort of husband that any self respecting man on the prowl for pussy should be searching out and cultivating.

Let's call him a Bull. It's a well deserved moniker for the kind of guy that most couples find most desirable when opening up the master bedroom door to include another man. He's reasonably polished. He's physically clean and capable. He's equipped and competent in the bedroom. And he's respectful of the marriage bond between the couple. You can call him a stud, a player. You may even call him your best friend. He's going to be a very important part of your lives forever, if only in fond memories.

Any way you cut it, the Bull and the wittol are a team. One compliments the other. Any Bull that goes into a cuckold (1), (2) or (3) scenario has to watch his back. His welfare, perhaps his very survival, is always hanging out there. One slip-up and the wet rumpled sheets could turn into a chalk outline on a bedroom floor. But if he teams up with a wittol, he's home free. Not only is most of his prep work done, the girl of his dreams comes gift wrapped. She has a place to stay, paid for. She has a car, paid for. She has a built in baby sitter if necessary. This lucky Bull doesn't have to worry about alibis, hidden emails, or leaving hickeys in nice places.

Every Bull worth his salt should seek out and foster wittols. They are his gateway to paradise. They will cover his back and his tracks, and pick up the tab. All he has to do is treat their wives right. Take care of them in the sack, let him watch once in a while, and maybe take a picture or two to jerk off to later. He doesn't have to abuse the wittol if the wittol doesn't want it. He should respect him, buy him a birthday gift, laugh at his jokes, appreciate what the wittol is giving him . He's the guy that's setting the Bull up with some mighty fine pussy. The wittol is the guy that meets you at the door and hangs up your coat while his wife is unzipping your pants.

So here we are. The wittol gets what he wants. The Bull gets what he wants. And the wife, the center of our attention, gets twice what she wants. She gets an adoring husband and provider and she also gets the excitement of an outside love interest without any complication or subterfuge. She probably won't tell her mom that she has found the secret to wedded bliss but I wouldn't bet that she doesn't tell her daughters. Secrets like this are too good to keep.

Just sounds like another term for a hotwife/vixens hubby often referred to as a stag.

 

[Houn Dawg]

Jeez, that's all so complicated it must make you tired before you even get to the foreplay. What happened to the good old days of just writing a little something on the men's (or lady's) room wall at the corner gas station. Nothing works like "For a good time call Betty (or Frank)" and add your home phone number. Then just sit back and wait for the phone to ring.

 

[AL7823]

Never heard of that phrase. I agree that if you're going to play with a married woman, get the green light from her husband. There's too much risk of things going south if you mess with the wrong husband in this country where many racists are armed to the teeth.

While there are many cucks who are cool with it, many are not. And yes, they will freak out, when they feel their wife cheated on them with a Black guy.

lots of folks armed to the teeth - racists for sure but all gangbangers as well and not the fuck women kind.

 

[Cucky0074]

I saw the word "wittol" used in an on-line story or news article recently. The context in which it was used left little doubt as to its intended meaning but I checked my desk top dictionary anyway. Pulling a blank with a Webster's wanna be, I Googled it. What an education!

First off, I discovered it names my affliction of many years. Been there, done that. Didn't know it had a name. It also nails down a common pastime of a large number of very happy people in our world. Defined, it loosely means husbands who enjoy letting other men fuck their wives.

It seems that the word "cuckold", an old and well used term, has several facets. Some nice, some not so much. Some forms are delightful, some destructive.

The four kinds of cuckolds are: (1) Husbands of wives that have lovers but know nothing of her actions. (2) Husbands who find out their wives have lovers and hit the ceiling. (3) Husbands who tolerate their wives dalliances for some reason but don't like it at all. (4) Husbands who like, even promote, their wives being with other men sexually.

In the first type, as long as the conditions are stable, i.e., hubby never finds out, all is well and good. This type may continue for all of their married lives and never cause any problem. A sort of "Ignorance is Bliss" or "What you don't know, can't hurt you" situation. I suspect this type is way more common than any statistic on successful marriages will ever reveal. Unfortunately, type (1) often suddenly becomes type (2) or (3) with unhappy results.

The second type is the dangerous one. For the wife and/or her lover, and anyone else within range. This cuckold type is not likely to have a happy ending for either of the participants, the willing or the deceived. Jealous rage by a wronged husband is not justification for mayhem in any modern court of law. Divorce, alimony, baby support and long prison terms, are all just minor implications associated with this cuckold type.

I find the third type to be the saddest of all. The long suffering wimp that knows what his wife, and the mom of his *******, is doing in her spare time and just barely tolerates it. He doesn't like it, it offends his manhood, he is humiliated in several ways, but he sticks with her. Their wedding vows may not mean much to her but they do to him. It may be the *******, it may be the mortgage, it may be his place in his social circle. Regardless of reason, he watches her go out at night and takes her back when she returns. The poor bastard may eventually either ******* himself to death or stick the shotgun in his mouth.

Then we come to the fourth type, the wittol. Here's the guy that likes, no loves, that his wife is open and forthright enough in her sexuality to indulge herself with other men. This is the guy that encourages his bride to seek out other men or at least to eagerly accept the ones he brings to her. A wittol is exactly the sort of husband that any self respecting man on the prowl for pussy should be searching out and cultivating.

Let's call him a Bull. It's a well deserved moniker for the kind of guy that most couples find most desirable when opening up the master bedroom door to include another man. He's reasonably polished. He's physically clean and capable. He's equipped and competent in the bedroom. And he's respectful of the marriage bond between the couple. You can call him a stud, a player. You may even call him your best friend. He's going to be a very important part of your lives forever, if only in fond memories.

Any way you cut it, the Bull and the wittol are a team. One compliments the other. Any Bull that goes into a cuckold (1), (2) or (3) scenario has to watch his back. His welfare, perhaps his very survival, is always hanging out there. One slip-up and the wet rumpled sheets could turn into a chalk outline on a bedroom floor. But if he teams up with a wittol, he's home free. Not only is most of his prep work done, the girl of his dreams comes gift wrapped. She has a place to stay, paid for. She has a car, paid for. She has a built in baby sitter if necessary. This lucky Bull doesn't have to worry about alibis, hidden emails, or leaving hickeys in nice places.

Every Bull worth his salt should seek out and foster wittols. They are his gateway to paradise. They will cover his back and his tracks, and pick up the tab. All he has to do is treat their wives right. Take care of them in the sack, let him watch once in a while, and maybe take a picture or two to jerk off to later. He doesn't have to abuse the wittol if the wittol doesn't want it. He should respect him, buy him a birthday gift, laugh at his jokes, appreciate what the wittol is giving him . He's the guy that's setting the Bull up with some mighty fine pussy. The wittol is the guy that meets you at the door and hangs up your coat while his wife is unzipping your pants.

So here we are. The wittol gets what he wants. The Bull gets what he wants. And the wife, the center of our attention, gets twice what she wants. She gets an adoring husband and provider and she also gets the excitement of an outside love interest without any complication or subterfuge. She probably won't tell her mom that she has found the secret to wedded bliss but I wouldn't bet that she doesn't tell her daughters. Secrets like this are too good to keep.

Ok I'm a number 4 and proud

 

[Houn Dawg]

Ok I'm a number 4 and proud

Join the crowd. I'm guessing that the majority of the members here are 4's. Or would like to be.

 

[Cucky0074]

Join the crowd. I'm guessing that the majority of the members here are 4's. Or would like to be.

I love serving my wife any way I can

 

[hungteacher]

I'm interested in hearing your perspective about how the pipeline should work these days in terms of matching people on a dating app, conversing with them, then eventually meeting them in person. I know that the online dating landscape has evolved over time, and then due to external influences like a pandemic, that has impacted things as well.

I'm currently testing our several platforms, and I see some common patterns across them.

I have used OKCupid for years, since that site has been the most friendly toward people who are polyamorous and have various non-traditional orientations, and relationship preferences. I've also liked the way their questions work to help determine compatibility. The biggest issue I felt it had is not having a big enough pool of users, and also that the more attractive someone is, the less they feel like they should need to invest into their profile/questions. At this point, it seems like the pool is even smaller, and I tend to see a lot of really political stuff in people's profiles, where they'll say things like "don't talk to me if you're not a communist," which can be a bit annoying to sort through.

I've also used Tinder for years, and have had ok luck with it. Lately, it seems like the ratio of bots to users is way up. Probably 2/3 of the potential matches you're swiping through are bots. They give users the option to verify their profiles, but many don't do it, so it's harder to tell the bots from the humans. For me, one of the giveaways is snapchat. If a user has their snapchat information in their profile, they're probably fake. And when you match, if pretty much the first thing they want is to move the conversation off the main platform, that's a red flag for them being a bot. Personally, I really hate snapchat both as an app and a company. The only time I ever use it is related to online dating. But so far, literally every single person who has ever asked me to add them on snap is just a bot/scammer. I've never really corresponded with a real human that I met through a dating app on SNAP.

Out of curiosity, I started messing with Facebook dating recently, and I feel like it has a similar ratio of bots to humans as Tinder. But every bot on Facebook wants you to add them to WhatsApp. It's interesting that Facebook owns WhatsApp, and how all the Facebook dating bots tell you to add them on WhatsApp, a Facebook owned company. Whereas, on Tinder, a competitor to Facebook, all the bots tell you to add them on SNAP, another Facebook competitor. I'm fairly sure that both Facebook and Tinder intentionally want bots on their platforms, for various business reasons, and both SNAP and WhatsApp also benefit from new users which might only be created by people who were asked by bots to add them.

Sites like Bumble, Hinge, and Feeld tend to have less bots, as far as I can tell so far. Surprisingly, the user experience doesn't feel as good. Without the bots (which often feature profile photos of actual models), it feels like there are less attractive people on those platforms, and less overall people to swipe through. I know this is one of the motivations for companies like FB/Tinder to intentionally have bots on their platforms -to function as a sort of bait and switch game.

When you overlay the whole pandemic scenario on top of everything, it's obvious that there are less active users on all of these platforms. People are just more reluctant to go out and meet others than they were two years ago. But obviously there are still lots of horny people who want to do all the things. They exist, somewhere.

Anyway, I guess what I'm wondering is, you mentioned that you were having this guy talking with these women on SNAP. But so far, the only real humans I know who are on there are people I already know from my phone contacts. No one I've matched with on a dating app who gives me their SNAP info is a real human.

What I prefer is to talk with people I match with on the app. When you reach the point where you can tell they're probably real, you can exchange numbers (ALWAYS use google voice for this). Then when the conversation moves to text, you can coordinate a time to meet for coffee/drinks, just go for a walk in a park (whatever you do needs to be public so everyone feels safe). If there's mutual interest, then you could either extend that meeting to go other places and do other things, or you can plan a 2nd date. I personally don't like to do dinner as a first meet, because if the person misrepresented themselves then you can get locked-in to a longer, more awkward situation. I will if they live far away and one of us is traveling further, but then there also needs to be more phone interaction first to get a higher confidence level that it's going to work for both people.

In the past, I'd sometimes thought that, if I was serving a bull, and working to curate new partners for him, then It might work best as a sort of combined profile, with photos of both of us just hanging out and a description which explains the dynamic in an attractive/suggestive but non-offensive way. Then when you approach, you do so in a normal way until you've established at least enough rapport to move the conversation to SMS. Then you can express interest in meeting, but before getting that far you need to confirm that they're interested in the overall arrangement. Probably, the first meet is just them and the wittol (to avoid wasting the bull's time), and the second meet would likely be with both. Beyond that, it could be any combination that meet the needs/interests of the parties involved. I feel like this could work, but I've never tried it, so I have no idea. And also, I know that sites like OKC/Feeld are fine with you making a sort of "combined" profile, but I've heard that Tinder deletes and blocks anything that looks like a couple's profile.

So, from your perspective, do real humans actually use apps like SNAP and WhatsApp? Is it worth it to bother with them at all? From my own experience, it seems like the answer is no, but maybe I'm doing something wrong. How do you think the overall idea/process would work?

I just saw your comment.
I cant make a comment about how you use Dating Apps, but I can say that your lack of consistency is a huge problem. Also, it seems you are overcomplicating things.

I currently have 5 real women that I am talking to using Snap. I just relocated to AZ, so these are brand new women that I did not know when I lived in NYC. The issue isn't going to be how many women I am talking to, the challenge is how many women can you speak with. Especially since you probably won't even believe that I am talking to 5 women on snap.

The one thing that you hit on the head is having a profile with you and the bull in photos. But in order to be a cuckold or a wittol, you need to spend more time with the woman than 1 date. Thats kind of what I was trying to convey in my previous post. The friendship needs to be there between bull and wittol. You need to enjoy talking to women. You need to enjoy meeting them.

I dont get that sense from what you wrote. It sounds like you feel talking to women and meeting them to be a real chore. Like this is a job you HAVE to do. Thats what it sounds like from what you wrote. Maybe its just your frustration coming through, but you should be aware that your frustration is coming through then. The mindset you need on a Dating App is "I like women."

It should be in the photos you post. You should look at your pictures and think, does this make me look "nice"
You dont want to be "attractive", you want to be "meet worthy" Its a whole different persona.
And your profile verbiage needs to convey that you are approachable. Most women do not like messaging first. so you need to state, ill make the first move, if you swipe Right.

I think too many men who want to be cuckolds and wittols, RUSH the courting process. If you think relationships and women are a CHORE, then they are not going to be interested in you. Thats my advice.

 

[hungteacher]

I'm sorry if I sounded like that in my tone.

I really love talking with women, and spending time in conversation getting to know them is very enjoyable for me -especially in person. I also don't mind meeting someone a few times before anything happens. I do know girls who have a "3 date rule," meaning that, if you haven't tried to sleep with them by the 3rd date, then you must not be interested/confident enough, and they need to move on to someone else who is. But when talking with people, you can get a feel for their comfort level and how they want things to go. My feeling is that, if my role were to curate play dates for a bull, then they should ideally be meeting within her expected timeframe.

And yeah, I'd love to be friends with the bull and get to hang out to build friendship and comfort between us. I've yet to meet anyone interested. Most seem to have the opinion of "don't talk to me unless you already have a girlfriend/wife who is already interested." I can understand why they'd have that perspective, but at the same time it defeats the point of this overall concept. Maybe the thing is to just keep approaching them until I find people who are more open minded? I know it takes a lot of failure to succeed, maybe I stopped too soon.

I know that, from an attraction standpoint, there are rules to the game. You need to be perceived in certain ways in order to maintain interest from the other person and your behavior, whether in person, or through text, needs to sustain that perception. If there's any part I don't really enjoy, it is the game that men and women are expected to play in order to facilitate the formation of a relationship. Trying not to appear overly interested, while simultaneously not being so aloof or disinterested that it shuts down communication. If you follow the advice of "just be yourself" or "act natural" and just communicate in the way you want to, it can be a red flag, make you appear too interested, too needy, etc. I've specifically been told by multiple people to wait to respond to text messages, even if I'm available right then and would naturally just respond to them "you don't want to seem too available" so you need to pretend not to be, even if you are. I love talking with women, so I know I'm more on the side of needing to hold back rather than not communicating enough. There are tons of coaching videos on youtube/ticktok to help with this. Probably anyone could learn things about themselves and others from watching them.

I've also been sure to get feedback on photos from girls I'm friends with as well as past partners. My photo game seems like it's where it needs to be for me as a solo poly person, but would obviously need updated to include a bull, if I could find one interested who I clicked with.

The issue I'm seeing (which may be regional), is that right now it seems the online dating platforms are pretty much just overloaded with bots. So there's a lot of filtering required just to find actual humans to talk to. Again, I love talking to actual humans, bots not so much.

I know SNAP is based in California, and they might have stronger user metrics out west than we do near Boston. Then maybe age is also a factor. Younger people don't use Facebook and prefer Instagram. Maybe there's a specific age range that uses SNAP. I have a lot of foreign friends who only use Instagram and prefer apps like Telegram for messaging. Many of them don't even know SNAP exists.

Another thing is that it is really a numbers game. Any attractive girl on a dating app is going to get overloaded with interest, so her inbox will fill up fast and old messages move to the bottom. You're probably one of 20 dudes she's talking to. So, you can start a conversation with someone that's going great, but then they disappear. If you try to move the conversation off the dating app too soon, then it's probably a red flag for them (you're either a bot or a creep), but if you wait too long, then they're going to disappear with one of the 20 other dudes. So you don't want to rush it, but you also don't want to wait too long, and you also know that probably half the messages you sent aren't going to get a response, not because they're not good enough as openers, but just because you're going to get lost in the noise, and you really only get one shot for an opener (trying to restart the conversation when they didn't respond the first time is a no-go). In the past, I always tried to switch to text with a Google Voice number. That still seems like the best option where I live, but you're using snap and lived in NYC, not far from Boston, so maybe you've got a different take on it?

As a polyamorous person, I've dated a lot of people over time, many of them people I met through online dating apps. So, I generally know the possibilities that those apps enable, and that you need to be using them consistently and correctly, playing the numbers game, continuing to seek out the latest advice from various coaches, etc.

Right now I have 1 femdom play partner who I originally met through OKC (she's married and only a top, not submissive to any men ever), and I'm talking talking via text with 2 women, 1 from Tinder and 1 from Feeld, and having several active in-app conversations with others on Tinder, OKC and Bumble. I have an upcoming weekend-long date planned with 1 person (since they are longer distance, so the drive needs to be worth it for them), and 1 coffee date planned with the other I'm texting with. The other conversations are promising, but until switching to SMS I never take them too seriously. None of them use snap though.

I don't doubt that you're talking to 5 women on snap -there are a lot of real users on there. It just might be more popular where you are than where I am. And maybe part of it depends on how you initially started talking with them. If you met them through your personal network, through past partners/friends, or through in-person meets, like munches, then it might make more sense that you ended up with snap as the method of communication. But, every day I get matches sending me their info, asking me to connect on snap or whatsapp, and I haven't talked with a real human that way yet.

thank you for your comment.
I think just reading your posts, the problem is that you "over think" practically everything.
Im not sure if you just overthink everything because you dont feel confident, or you are still not sure what you are doing
but there is no reason to over complicate this.

Women respond to men who dont bull ******* them, are honest, and will treat them with respect.
Thats the secret. Theres nothing more to it.
The problem for most guys is they dont do that.
Your messages are full of Nonsense. But let me be more clear. You are dumping out into the world all of your "thinking" which is stuff you dont need to share. So what you might be thinking is honesty, is more OVER SHARING...if that makes more sense.
And a lot of sub men do that all the time. They overshare, in misguided logic. They believe that being honest means telling every secret thought they have.

It comes down to one thing. If you are a sub, what does that look like in real life? A woman wants to know what she is getting involved in?
If you dont know what a relationship looks like, you are going to have a hard time.
But if you are a sub that likes to give a lot of attention, then you need to say that. "I like to send 10 texts per day, can you handle that?"

Women want to know what you will be like PRACTICALLY before getting too involved. They love sub men, what they dont like are men that are full of *******.

 

[Carl C]

I saw the word "wittol" used in an on-line story or news article recently. The context in which it was used left little doubt as to its intended meaning but I checked my desk top dictionary anyway. Pulling a blank with a Webster's wanna be, I Googled it. What an education!

First off, I discovered it names my affliction of many years. Been there, done that. Didn't know it had a name. It also nails down a common pastime of a large number of very happy people in our world. Defined, it loosely means husbands who enjoy letting other men fuck their wives.

It seems that the word "cuckold", an old and well used term, has several facets. Some nice, some not so much. Some forms are delightful, some destructive.

The four kinds of cuckolds are: (1) Husbands of wives that have lovers but know nothing of her actions. (2) Husbands who find out their wives have lovers and hit the ceiling. (3) Husbands who tolerate their wives dalliances for some reason but don't like it at all. (4) Husbands who like, even promote, their wives being with other men sexually.

In the first type, as long as the conditions are stable, i.e., hubby never finds out, all is well and good. This type may continue for all of their married lives and never cause any problem. A sort of "Ignorance is Bliss" or "What you don't know, can't hurt you" situation. I suspect this type is way more common than any statistic on successful marriages will ever reveal. Unfortunately, type (1) often suddenly becomes type (2) or (3) with unhappy results.

The second type is the dangerous one. For the wife and/or her lover, and anyone else within range. This cuckold type is not likely to have a happy ending for either of the participants, the willing or the deceived. Jealous rage by a wronged husband is not justification for mayhem in any modern court of law. Divorce, alimony, baby support and long prison terms, are all just minor implications associated with this cuckold type.

I find the third type to be the saddest of all. The long suffering wimp that knows what his wife, and the mom of his *******, is doing in her spare time and just barely tolerates it. He doesn't like it, it offends his manhood, he is humiliated in several ways, but he sticks with her. Their wedding vows may not mean much to her but they do to him. It may be the *******, it may be the mortgage, it may be his place in his social circle. Regardless of reason, he watches her go out at night and takes her back when she returns. The poor bastard may eventually either ******* himself to death or stick the shotgun in his mouth.

Then we come to the fourth type, the wittol. Here's the guy that likes, no loves, that his wife is open and forthright enough in her sexuality to indulge herself with other men. This is the guy that encourages his bride to seek out other men or at least to eagerly accept the ones he brings to her. A wittol is exactly the sort of husband that any self respecting man on the prowl for pussy should be searching out and cultivating.

Let's call him a Bull. It's a well deserved moniker for the kind of guy that most couples find most desirable when opening up the master bedroom door to include another man. He's reasonably polished. He's physically clean and capable. He's equipped and competent in the bedroom. And he's respectful of the marriage bond between the couple. You can call him a stud, a player. You may even call him your best friend. He's going to be a very important part of your lives forever, if only in fond memories.

Any way you cut it, the Bull and the wittol are a team. One compliments the other. Any Bull that goes into a cuckold (1), (2) or (3) scenario has to watch his back. His welfare, perhaps his very survival, is always hanging out there. One slip-up and the wet rumpled sheets could turn into a chalk outline on a bedroom floor. But if he teams up with a wittol, he's home free. Not only is most of his prep work done, the girl of his dreams comes gift wrapped. She has a place to stay, paid for. She has a car, paid for. She has a built in baby sitter if necessary. This lucky Bull doesn't have to worry about alibis, hidden emails, or leaving hickeys in nice places.

Every Bull worth his salt should seek out and foster wittols. They are his gateway to paradise. They will cover his back and his tracks, and pick up the tab. All he has to do is treat their wives right. Take care of them in the sack, let him watch once in a while, and maybe take a picture or two to jerk off to later. He doesn't have to abuse the wittol if the wittol doesn't want it. He should respect him, buy him a birthday gift, laugh at his jokes, appreciate what the wittol is giving him . He's the guy that's setting the Bull up with some mighty fine pussy. The wittol is the guy that meets you at the door and hangs up your coat while his wife is unzipping your pants.

So here we are. The wittol gets what he wants. The Bull gets what he wants. And the wife, the center of our attention, gets twice what she wants. She gets an adoring husband and provider and she also gets the excitement of an outside love interest without any complication or subterfuge. She probably won't tell her mom that she has found the secret to wedded bliss but I wouldn't bet that she doesn't tell her daughters. Secrets like this are too good to keep.

Well stated. I’m proud—and fortunate—to be number 4.