NFL, Kneeling and "Disrespect"

[TwoBiFour]

t, twisting the symbolism of a fist in the air as athletes take the field at the playing of the national anthem with being about Black power and that the majority of athletes in the NFL are criminals.

Talk about twisting things - No one said the "Majority" 50% is not the majority and 20% is far from it.
But here is some irony for you (head lines today)-
http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl...ery-and-*******-charges/ar-AAtjs8I?li=BBnbfcL

Now I am sure that has nothing to do with his race or the fact that he is a football player. He is Human just like the rest of us. Humans do stupid things, humans make mistakes. So it stands to reason some of those humans will play sports.

The exchange on this thread has been enlightening to see how people are just projecting their personal opinions and nothing substantive towards moving the discussion forward on understanding the real issues.

You mean you don't want to discuss anything with anyone who does not totally 100% agree with your view point. You claim the system is raciest, I challenge you to point out one law in this country that specifically singles out blacks. Even our Constitution states: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.". If our founding fathers were so raciest it would have stated "...all white men..."

The system isn't raciest - People are raciest and when placed in positions of power it can be abused by those people or persons. So again, lets see how many government run programs there are that specifically single out blacks (or any minority) in favor of whites. There isn't a single public or government run organization that is allowed to single out minorities. If you really want to discuss equality (which really is separate from racism), then lets start with the Black Negro Collage Fund , the BET awards, NCAA, Black History Month, The BLM, Lets see how Al Sharpton feels about Black gangs beating the ******* of a white kid - That's right, he had nothing to say. Here is a list of many more programs that single out the white man in favor of the black and are allowed to by law.
http://www.diversitybestpractices.com/news-articles/20-african-american-organizations-you-need-know

The police ******* you speak of is not the normal. As much as you want it to be, racism in the police ******* is a small percentage, and again it is the person that is raciest and not the system. There is no law that gives police power over minorities that they don't have over whites. Most recent cases it has been proven that the person in question was not cooperating with the officers instruction. Does that mean they should be shot? Maybe - Maybe not but I really don't think the majority of incidence had anything to do with race. Police shoot unarmed white guys also but no one wants to discuss that - do you? Yes, there is a disproportional % of blacks to whites that get arrested - but there is also a disproportional % of blacks to Black population committing crimes. All of your information seems to leave that tid-bit out.

Candace McCoy is a criminologist at the John Jay College of Criminal Justice at the City University of New York. McCoy said blacks might be more likely to have a violent encounter with police because they are convicted of felonies at a higher rate than whites. Felonies include everything from violent crimes like ******* and *******, to property crimes like burglary and embezzlement, to ******* trafficking and gun offenses.

http://www.politifact.com/punditfac...-show-host-police-*******-more-whites-blacks/

Here are some good examples why officers loose their cool, (people are assholes)

Here is a good read for you;
http://www.understandingprejudice.org/readroom/articles/affirm.htm
Now I understand their are raciest people in the world, and I'm sure things have happened to minorities that were unjust, but that doesn't mean I should apologize for being white - or that I should take a back seat. Personally I don't look at a mans skin color, I look at their character and actions. It's funny you post a quote about people being quick to judge - and then you quickly judge and discount anyone who has difference of opinion instead of trying to understand where that person might be coming from, it's easier to simply close the door on them. I'm not trying to pretend racism doesn't happen, nor am I trying to deny there is a problem. But the door swings both ways. Are you going to try and convince me that if I went to a predominantly black community and walk into the local McDonald's that they will be all happy and joyful to see me and welcome me in? Are you going to tell me any black Officer does not treat white suspects differently?

The exchange on this thread has been enlightening to see how people are just projecting their personal opinions and nothing substantive towards moving the discussion forward on understanding the real issues.

So far you have done the same, simply projected your personal opinion and said nothing substantive towards moving the discussion forward. So why don't you start? Post clearly what the "real issue" is and what, in your opinion needs to be done to change it. Or, you can simply discount me as a person and my opinion doesn't matter. After all - is that not your goal? Part of eliminating Racism is changing peoples attitudes towards others. Posting what you just did does nothing but drive the wedge further - It tells me you are not open to discussion, but rather Your way or the highway.

 

[MacNfries]

The exchange on this thread has been enlightening to see how people are just projecting their personal opinions and nothing substantive towards moving the discussion forward on understanding the real issues.

Appreciate those who outed themselves on here on having nothing of significance to contribute but BS so we now know to dismiss any further responses as non-relevant

I've been saying this to him for months ... his only purpose in discussions is to toss in grenades as a "drive-by" poster. Never initiates discussions, just looks for fragments of a discussion posted by liberal minded individuals that he can point error or lack of clarity to. Look at it this way, bbb76 ... he'll point out only 1% of your posts, so that means the remaining 99% is either too challenging for him to rebuttal, or its right ... either way, that's the essence of his contributions to the threads.
Congratulations!

 

[TwoBiFour]

You do realize that the if the NFL does indeed start to loose their fan base, and thus their profits, you will see a strong swing with the owners opinions in the opposite direction.

I hate to say I told you so.... but,

Now that player protests appear to be hitting owners, TV networks and corporate sponsors in the pocketbook, it's probably no coincidence Goodell wants all players to stand for the national anthem. The NFL finds itself in a "very volatile and dangerous place," said ESPN Insider Adam Schefter on Thursday's "Mike & Mike" morning show.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl...ne-early-in-2017-season/ar-AAtjtDv?li=BBnb7Kz

For the NFL it is about it's about the bottom line. Will be interesting to see how many players quit when they are ****** to chose between what they think they believe and what they get paid to do. Could get ugly.

 

[hoping hubby]

his only purpose in discussions is to toss in grenades as a "drive-by" poster.

I'm not supplying grenades. You do that when you post something stunningly stupid (like when you claimed Trump just gave $110 billion of taxpayer money to the arabs, when in fact the arabs were buying $110 billion from us....or just today when you were completely ass backwards about the science of ozone and global warming....or when you tried to claim we didn't understand black holes) I merely pull the pin on the grenade in your hand

Look at it this way, bbb76 ... he'll point out only 1% of your posts, so that means the remaining 99% is either too challenging for him to rebuttal, or its right ...

Or I have a life and pick and choose when I wish to spend my time responding.....or I didn't even read the post. Hell I skip right over most of BBB76 or subhubs posts on the political threads. They're 90% rambling copy and pastes with little to no original thought or content.

 

[MacNfries]

 

[MyWhiteCousin]

get off your fucking knee and support the flag... other wise move to a country like iran or syria... i'm sure you'll miss us.... most people have enough brains to stand

 

[subhub174014]

his shirt says he stands for the national anthem....real respect for the flag wouldn't you say?

 

[TwoBiFour]

his shirt says he stands for the national anthem....real respect for the flag wouldn't you say?

View attachment 1515913

Last I knew, the Flag wasn't suppose to touch the ground. Learned that in 1st grade -


I don't like using the flag for clothing either.

 

[subhub174014]

I don't like using the flag for clothing either.

what happened to respecting the flag?

I really didn't like it when Kid Rock wore one as a robe!
I have mixed feeling about the kneeling during the anthem..i understand they have a statement to be made and do agree they are getting a raw deal on a lot of police arrests...but.....????

that is a far cry from sitting on one or burning one or WEARING one as a fucking robe!

been me taking that pic...I would have kicked his ass right after! and if I didn't kick his ass he would have atleast knew I tried!

 

[TwoBiFour]

I regretfully never served. My ******* and Brother did as did several of my friends. One thing they have all told me. No matter what - you respect the uniform. You don't have to like the person wearing it, but you better respect the rank. I view the flag and country the same way. I don't have to like a lot of things that go on, but I still respect it's colors. I can protest in many other ways, I can be pissed about many things but I'm still proud to be an American. Our flag and country is the only thing left holding us together.

If you want to protest Trump, then Protest Trump - but respect the Presidency.
If you want to protest Police then protest at the departments - but respect the Badge.

 

[subhub174014]

but respect the Presidency

that is something that went the way...and not right!
remember that congressman calling Obama a liar during a congressional speech on national tv?

can't remember who that was but sure hope he is not in office today!

as for Trump...he has made a mockery of what was once a highly regarded position...so not sure if the public is to blame for that one

 

[TwoBiFour]

remember that congressman calling Obama a liar during a congressional speech

Yes, and for the record, I didn't agree with that either.

 

[BabiBear85]

I think the big thing, or at least for me, is what you believe the flag stands for and protest is going against. I agree that there should not be racism and it should not be tolerated from any race towards any race. When I hear the national anthem and I stand for it I am standing to thank the men and women who fought for our country in the past, present, and who will in the future. In my opinion a better demonstration against racism would be all the different races of players going out together as one and showing they are united versus kneeling during the national anthem. Again this is just my opinion though and I am not trying to start a debate or offend anyone.

 

[BigBlackBull76]

get off your fucking knee and support the flag... other wise move to a country like iran or syria... i'm sure you'll miss us.... most people have enough brains to stand

I gave up wasting time on this as people are self-absorbed in their feelings and lack an understanding or show empathy but a strong opinion deserves a strong response.

@MyWhiteCousin - I respect other peoples opinions and their strong feelings about respecting the flag and being patriotic and all that but I also respect life and I respect life more than a symbol and that includes a flag. People are not listening to one another nor investigating, and trying to understand whats going on which is why we are in the situation we are in.

We don't live in Syria nor Iran but in a nation that is supposed to be a Democratic Republic where all people are allowed to vote and they elect officials to represent them with a Government elected by the people working for the people and that include per our bill of rights to "the right of the people...to petition the Government for a redress of grievances".

You feel what some people are doing is wrong but what they are doing some people feel is right toward trying to fix the injustices that are occurring in the justice system which the Government has the power and capability in addressing. What Colin K. and others who are conducting silent protests and being active in the communities are doing is raising awareness to America's ugly under-belly that people just don't want to look at and face. And it makes it worse when a sitting President wades in and doesn't take into consideration the rights of all the people whom he was elected to represent and protect but uses it as a wedge issue to further divide people which the athletes had all the right to counter-protest against that ugliness from an already ugly individual. See the post here with Trump's history of ugly tweets:
https://www.blacktowhite.net/thread...ump-gets-impeached.92341/page-58#post-1577242

Most people in America are just waking up that there is a serious issue going on and its because of what some of these brave American's who just happen to be Athletes are doing to raise awareness to the issue.

I don't have the time now and I've already written some stories on this website about my similar experiences to Philando Castile where I was stopped by police officers and had guns pulled on me although I did nothing wrong and could have easily lost my life similar to what happend to Philando.

One time I was driving down in Baltimore and an unmarked car drove down past me then swung a U-turn and flashed on its lights behind me. I pulled over and then three men who all happened to be white wearing body armor came out yelling for me to get out of the car with my hands up. I did so and they stated that I fit the description of someone an informant had tipped them off of and one of the officers flashed up his cell phone to supposedly show me the info and that they wanted to search me and my vehicle. Because they had Guns drawn on me I didn't say anything but I just nodded my head.

They hand-cuffed me placed me on the curve and wen't all through my vehicle. After they finished searching and then apologized about them making a mistake I let them have it after they're guns were holstered. They said yeah well we all have a hard job to do but the way they came out with the guns on me - something easily could've happened same as it happened to Philando Castile and just like him do you think justice would've be served or met for me? Thats not even the end of it, I have 4 more stories I could tell you like that of my experiences with getting pulled over and searched by the police and I've never sold *******, done anything outside of puff a little MJ (which i did in college over 10yrs ago but haven't since) and I have nothing on my record but a few speeding tickets. Yeah we need to take a knee on the flag - this is a code emergency in this country and has been for a very long time. Most of white America has been asleep to whats been happening. Philando Castile, Sean Bell, Amadou Diallo, Trayvon Martin, Eric Gardner, Sandra Bland, and so many others you know what they all have in common? They were innocent, they were stopped by the police (or in one case with Trayvon - a wannabe) in a routine situation nothing criminal (Eric was selling loose Cigs. ok) and they all ended up dead and all of the police were let off the hook - NO CHARGES - NOT A SINGLE ONE!

I still love America, I still respect those who served, those who've died, all that no one is disrespecting any of that or them. However is it still too much to still expect the country to respect, protect, and bring justice to all of its people which is not what is occurring and until that happens we will continue to peacefully protest. In impoverished neighborhoods and because of some people's shade of skin its automatically condemned and they are not treated fairly by the system and people are taking action to say enough is enough and I will always take a knee to stand-up for those others who are voiceless and can't speak for themselves, are not being heard, or DEAD!
​

​

 

[BigBlackBull76]

#IM WITH KAP
(ALL THE WAY)!!!
And Congrats to him on winning recognition as GQ Citizen of the Year​

​

And for the record the man (who happens to be bi-racial) has put his money where is mouth is so it wasn't something he did without taking social action off the field as well - Do some research.

Statements to read, ponder, and consider from other American Citizens reflecting on the situation in the GQ magazine of the issue with the cover above:

​

 

[BigBlackBull76]

Talk about twisting things - No one said the "Majority" 50% is not the majority and 20% is far from it.
But here is some irony for you (head lines today)-
http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl...ery-and-*******-charges/ar-AAtjs8I?li=BBnbfcL

Now I am sure that has nothing to do with his race or the fact that he is a football player. He is Human just like the rest of us. Humans do stupid things, humans make mistakes. So it stands to reason some of those humans will play sports.

You mean you don't want to discuss anything with anyone who does not totally 100% agree with your view point. You claim the system is raciest, I challenge you to point out one law in this country that specifically singles out blacks. Even our Constitution states: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.". If our founding fathers were so raciest it would have stated "...all white men..."

The system isn't raciest - People are raciest and when placed in positions of power it can be abused by those people or persons. So again, lets see how many government run programs there are that specifically single out blacks (or any minority) in favor of whites. There isn't a single public or government run organization that is allowed to single out minorities. If you really want to discuss equality (which really is separate from racism), then lets start with the Black Negro Collage Fund , the BET awards, NCAA, Black History Month, The BLM, Lets see how Al Sharpton feels about Black gangs beating the ******* of a white kid - That's right, he had nothing to say. Here is a list of many more programs that single out the white man in favor of the black and are allowed to by law.
http://www.diversitybestpractices.com/news-articles/20-african-american-organizations-you-need-know

The police ******* you speak of is not the normal. As much as you want it to be, racism in the police ******* is a small percentage, and again it is the person that is raciest and not the system. There is no law that gives police power over minorities that they don't have over whites. Most recent cases it has been proven that the person in question was not cooperating with the officers instruction. Does that mean they should be shot? Maybe - Maybe not but I really don't think the majority of incidence had anything to do with race. Police shoot unarmed white guys also but no one wants to discuss that - do you? Yes, there is a disproportional % of blacks to whites that get arrested - but there is also a disproportional % of blacks to Black population committing crimes. All of your information seems to leave that tid-bit out.


http://www.politifact.com/punditfac...-show-host-police-*******-more-whites-blacks/

Here are some good examples why officers loose their cool, (people are assholes)

Here is a good read for you;
http://www.understandingprejudice.org/readroom/articles/affirm.htm
Now I understand their are raciest people in the world, and I'm sure things have happened to minorities that were unjust, but that doesn't mean I should apologize for being white - or that I should take a back seat. Personally I don't look at a mans skin color, I look at their character and actions. It's funny you post a quote about people being quick to judge - and then you quickly judge and discount anyone who has difference of opinion instead of trying to understand where that person might be coming from, it's easier to simply close the door on them. I'm not trying to pretend racism doesn't happen, nor am I trying to deny there is a problem. But the door swings both ways. Are you going to try and convince me that if I went to a predominantly black community and walk into the local McDonald's that they will be all happy and joyful to see me and welcome me in? Are you going to tell me any black Officer does not treat white suspects differently?

So far you have done the same, simply projected your personal opinion and said nothing substantive towards moving the discussion forward. So why don't you start? Post clearly what the "real issue" is and what, in your opinion needs to be done to change it. Or, you can simply discount me as a person and my opinion doesn't matter. After all - is that not your goal? Part of eliminating Racism is changing peoples attitudes towards others. Posting what you just did does nothing but drive the wedge further - It tells me you are not open to discussion, but rather Your way or the highway.

BLUF: Well @TwoBiFour where I never personally took odds with much of anything you wrote or posted on here, I appreciate you taking the time to have actually read some of the things I posted and now I hope you are actually trying to engage and advance this discussion and not just want to be coy with tit for tat 'gotcha-isms'.

So lets have a real discourse. The point I exasperatedly was making was that yes people continue to talking past one another only stating their personal feelings never looking at the main issue which is the meaning behind why the players where kneeling, and the root cause of the issue of social injustice. Thank you for challenging and asking me to address the issues and offer solutions.

First off, outside of my response to @alpha Ryder’s original post and my big red Facts comments - I haven’t posted much opinionated statements and I counter your claim that I haven't been clearly posting what the “real issue” is. I've outlayed them time and time again in alignment with what Colin Kap initially set-off the whole kneeling protest to begin with but here I will clearly lay them out for you below since they seem to have gotten overlooked or muddled in all the posting:

Issue 1: Social injustice - wrongful deaths, no justice brought against the innocent lives that were murdered. People deflect and just say - oh people don't follow the laws or instructions of the police - thats complete B.S. Hence my dejection of all the counter-comments.

Issue 2: Colin Kapernick bravely and heroically ‘taking a knee’ to take stand for Real Justice

Issue 3: The right of the players to protest by kneeling during the National Anthem and as being a patriotic act

Issue 4: Claims and the false narrative that what the NFL players are doing is offensive to the Military or Police

Issue 5: Trump’s inaccurate, ignominious, and pompous statements about NFL players and their cause being as an offensive to the Military and Law Enforcement.

I appreciate you bringing up the question on what are some solutions. These are not my opinions as I do my homework and can rely on facts so here wold be some Specific, Measurable, Attainable, Realistic, and Timely objectives and goals to address the issue.

Talk about twisting things - No one said the "Majority" 50% is not the majority and 20% is far from it.
But here is some irony for you (head lines today)-
http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl...ery-and-*******-charges/ar-AAtjs8I?li=BBnbfcL

Now I am sure that has nothing to do with his race or the fact that he is a football player. He is Human just like the rest of us. Humans do stupid things, humans make mistakes. So it stands to reason some of those humans will play sports.

Just as easily as you can snatch or grab a headline from the day about football plays so can I of some one who is not a sports athlete committing similar and even more henious acts. Human's do make mistakes, but some men are monsters and they make no mistakes. No they just make a travesty out of innocent human lives which is what this whole issue is about with the loss of innocent lives and some people who have a platform using it to bring awareness about the social issue.

Just examples of random ******* pulled from the headlines.
​

So what is your point? Do NFL players have a monopoly on committing crimes? No not the Majority (50%+1), 50% and not even a number as high as 20%. This was some arbitrary number pulled out of someone’s ass and I made a rebuttal with an even more egregious number so sue me. We both exaggerated numbers.* However how many police officers were held accountable for the ******* and taking of innocent lives? That number is higher than 50% and that's still ISSUE #1.

Yes Police officers are humans and make mistakes but as the meme above shows they can deliberately apprehend people who do happen to be armed and dangerous and have actually committed a crime without murdering them.

You mean you don't want to discuss anything with anyone who does not totally 100% agree with your view point. You claim the system is raciest, I challenge you to point out one law in this country that specifically singles out blacks. Even our Constitution states: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.". If our founding fathers were so raciest it would have stated "...all white men..."

No but to the contrary my dear I added on to the discussions and thanked the Original poster for starting the thread. Its not about agreeing with my view point 100% as I simply pointed out that some people were projecting their opinionated biases and subtle racists comment never discussing, attempting to understand, or address the root causes of the issue itself but merely making statements condemning the players or why they feel you should stand for the flag.

You accuse me of twisting words which I never did but maybe twisted a percentage by 1-point to a 51% majority from a 50% half so sue me. But now you want to twist and put words in my mouth with the claim I said or imply that “the system is racist”. I only stated there are inequalities in our society, I NEVER made the statement the “racist system” or the "system is racist" and how naive can you be to bring up the constitution when not only all of the writers of the document kept Black people in ****** servitude (slavery) during the writing but it also contained a statement that blacks were only counted as 3/5s to equal every white person in the southern states and had no rights to vote. The 13th and 14th amendment had to be ratified and inserted in order to allow Blacks to have equal rights and its still an amendment which amazingly has to be voted on and re-ratified (how crazy is that). This was the law until the 13th and 14th amendments were ratified into the Constitution.

For your information:

The 13th Amendment to the Constitution declared that "Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction." Formally abolishing slavery in the United States, the 13th Amendment was passed by the Congress on January 31, 1865, and ratified by the states on December 6, 1865.
ref: Wikipedia

Now although I never made the charge about the ‘System being racist’ I accept your challenge to point how several laws which have been legally acknowledged and struck down in this country that specifically singled out Black people:

Texas voter law
Some states have been found to violate the civil rights of minority voters during multiple redistricting cycles. Texas’ district lines — drawn by both Republican and Democrat-controlled legislatures — have been thrown out on racial-discrimination grounds for nearly 30 years — during the redistricting of the 1990s, the 2000s and the 2010s.

North Carolina Voter law
North Carolina has gone through three election cycles using state legislative lines later found to be discriminatory.

Federal ******* Sentencing Laws (Anti ******* Abuse Law)
Unfair Crack - an addictive white substance sentencing. This is especially true for crack-an addictive white substance defendants, most of whom are black; despite the Fair Sentencing Act of 2010, selling a small quantity of crack an addictive white substance (28 grams) carries the same mandatory minimum sentence—five years—as selling 500 grams of powder an addictive white substance whom distributers and consumers are mostly white. So if your white and have 28 grams of an addictive white substance which can product 28 different crack viles of 28 grams you would still get a lighter sentence.

According to Sen. Robert Byrd (A known racist), cosponsor of the Anti-******* Abuse Act of 1986, the reason to attach five- and ten-year mandatory sentences to ******* trafficking was to punish “the kingpins—the masterminds who are really running these operations”, and the mid-level dealers.

Push people into certain communities, in which they lack economic and educational resources, no capital injection, stimulus, and its a self fulfilling cycle. You leave them with ******* - the people in those communities never had planes or trucks to ship the guns and ******* in by the Godfather, Air America, Tom Cruises new move, an addictive white substance Cowboys, Ronald Reagan (iran Contra Hearings) and George Bush Sr. (CIA- Panama files) showed you how the ******* and guns got into the inner city.

All Post American Civil War, Reconstruction, Civil Rights Bill and Laws
Black people still had their basic human rights infringed upon by Jim Crow after the civil war during reconstruction, all the way up into the 1960s (just less than 50yrs ago) with transpiration discrimination, education discrimination, housing discrimination, job discrimination,. You think just because Blacks led a civil rights fight, marched, protested, and LBJ initiated some laws the it was totally able to erase the remnants of racism from out of all institutions of the US?

The system isn't raciest - People are raciest and when placed in positions of power it can be abused by those people or persons. So again, lets see how many government run programs there are that specifically single out blacks (or any minority) in favor of whites. There isn't a single public or government run organization that is allowed to single out minorities. If you really want to discuss equality (which really is separate from racism), then lets start with the Black Negro Collage Fund , the BET awards, NCAA, Black History Month, The BLM, Lets see how Al Sharpton feels about Black gangs beating the ******* of a white kid - That's right, he had nothing to say. Here is a list of many more programs that single out the white man in favor of the black and are allowed to by law.

Wow, just when I though the statements wouldn't get any more incredulous.

Again you are making the claim that the system is racist not me. However the Good Ol’ boy network, nepotism, favoritism, hegemony, cronyism, and yes good ol fashion plain racism and discrimination against even women and LGBT such as Trumps actions to bar LGBT’s to serve in the military and have fair rights in the Government does constitute and stir up a roll-back to the 1960’s which is what we know deep down is the code word for “Make America Great Again” in Trump’s nation.

Black people created their own programs to provide recognition where and when they weren’t getting recognition from main-stream America. And the fact of the matter is they still don’t fairly and equally get recognition such as from the Oscars and American Musics Awards. Just two years ago Chris Rock hosted and called out the Oscar for all their FUCKED up nominations and awards on movies totally never acknowledging black films unless it has something to do with slavery or being a maid or butler. Yeah fuck the Grammys, and Academy Awards voting board as they don't know nor recognize great black artists. All the great roles that Denzel and Halle Berry portrayed and they get recognized for a corrupt cop (Training Day) and being a super-sexed slut (Monsters Ball)? So what the fuck is the Academy Awards voting board trying to say here really hmmm?

Here see and listen for yourself what Eddie Murphy pointed out in 1988!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

​

Then in 2016 - 28 years later after Eddie made the statement Chris Rock still had to address the issue of NO BLACK RECOGNITION when he hosted the Oscars during the opening monologue.
So your DAM right Black people felt the need to organize their own programs to raise funding for college educations but whats so wrong with that with the UNCF?

The NCAA - that's the National College Athletic Association but I think you meant to call out the NCAAP. I'll forgive you although you felt you needed to rake me over the hot coals for exaggerating 20% being a majority statement.

When was the NCAAP founded and what was it founded for? Man do they actually teach nothing in predominantly white schools but European history like the Greeks invented philosophy, and Math, Christopher Columbus proved the earth was round and discovered America (all of which are false I hope you know), Abraham Lincoln freed the people who were ****** into slavery, Martin Luther King gave a great speech and here we are today?

I wont waste time writing the story for you but here watch this short 4minute video and the NCAAP was founded by White people so you KNOW!!!!!! (AND BLESS THEIR HEROIC HEARTS):

​

Black History Month started off as Black History Week in 1926 and noticed its in the shortest month of the year. Hey 365 days of the year is White American history so whats so bad especially when here its obvious that people are still lack knowledge (instead of calling them out as ignorant) on the history of Black people in the world and especially here in America.

The BLM, Al Sharpton statements are just as ridiculous as trying to crucify and blame all white people for Neo Nazi marches and Donald Trump in America. It's a far stretch and my prior statement dismisses the ridiculousness in even responding seriously. Hey to quote Donald J. Trump "there are good people on both sides" right? Yeah right. One group of people march to advocate standing up for the rights of people who've had their rights trampled upon, the other group wants to march to usurp their so-called white supremacy over everyone else and feel their rights to have White Supremacist statues taken down is trampling on their rights although that's what the city sovereignty voted adn decided to enact. NO freaking equation of the two in that respect there.

The police ******* you speak of is not the normal. As much as you want it to be, racism in the police ******* is a small percentage, and again it is the person that is raciest and not the system. There is no law that gives police power over minorities that they don't have over whites. Most recent cases it has been proven that the person in question was not cooperating with the officers instruction. Does that mean they should be shot? Maybe - Maybe not but I really don't think the majority of incidence had anything to do with race. Police shoot unarmed white guys also but no one wants to discuss that - do you? Yes, there is a disproportional % of blacks to whites that get arrested - but there is also a disproportional % of blacks to Black population committing crimes. All of your information seems to leave that tid-bit out.

To the contrary my dear, you are over-reaching with your comments and statements here and again missing the issue. Everyone wants to pivot to say not all police are racists, people not cooperating with police instructions, Police shooting unarmed whites, no one mentions black on black crime (we always leave that tid-bit out).

None of those points were ever a part of the topic nor issue here which I highlighted up above with what the #1 ISSUE was and I have stayed on message through-out all of my posts. Lets stick to one issue, then we can move down the line. If you want to have a discussion about black on black crime, root causes and solutions I welcome that discussion as well but lets give that the proper justice and come out to the communities I work in so we can really give that topic understanding it deserves and thats not going to happen here over this computer medium. No you need real insight into the problems that plague that world and there are real solutions which do center around people loving children and providing them guidance and education. There are examples where it has worked and gang violence was stomped out through-out complete sections of major US cities but again thats too deep for a discussion here.

I did have a thread about policy ******* before where I pointed out that some cops did ******* an unarmed white man around an area I lived in VA and how the courts slow-rolled and stone-walled the case. Even the other white people in my neighborhood were rallying about the issue and when I can find that post from 3years ago I will post the link on here for you.

Statistically more unarmed blacks are shot, killed, and with no charges brought up after investigations than any other group of Americans. Why is that - again inequalities and fair representation in the Justice system is a factor. Even Black police officers who have shot innocent Black people and killed them get off. So its not just simply a White Cop black person thing and I've NEVER made the statement anywhere on these threads about a racist system as again you have projected those words not I.

I can post, cite, reference tables and charts here all day but just refer to a couple of scientific data analytical studies here for your review:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...han-black-people-killed-by-police-yes-but-no/

Part of the problem as to why this is happening is because of what psychologist label as implicit bias.

"Implicit bias describes the automatic association people make between groups of people and stereotypes about those groups. Under certain conditions, those automatic associations can influence behavior—making people respond in biased ways even when they are not explicitly prejudiced. More than thirty years of research in neurology and social and cognitive psychology has shown that people hold implicit biases even in the absence of heartfelt bigotry, simply by paying attention to the social world around them. Implicit racial bias has given rise to a phenomenon known as “racism without racists,” which can cause institutions or individuals to act on racial prejudices, even in spite of good intentions and nondiscriminatory policies or standards."

ref: https://trustandjustice.org/resources/intervention/implicit-bias

Here are the studies on implicit bias and Policing toward Black people:

http://www.apa.org/monitor/2016/12/cover-policing.aspx

One proposed scientifically tested solution (and not in my opinion) on addressing this issue is as follows:

Training Police Officers to recognize and suppress Implicit Bias

"But one training doesn't necessarily erase prejudices, the experts say, especially if it's led not by a law enforcement agent, but by a coach or an academic who may not easily earn the trust of participants.

"If you've got a resistant room, they're not going to be able to say, 'No, really, this works,'" Goff said.


And preliminary research indicates even those who have been trained often return to their original biases over time.


"The training can move the needle on implicit bias temporarily. But the research shows for long-term impact, there needs to be ongoing engagement," Marks said.


For example, he said, if someone has been exposed to 1,000 associations of a black male criminal over a lifetime through movies, TV and music, but only 10 associations of a black male Ph.D, "It's more likely that their association with criminals will be activated because it's just more exposure. So one strategy to undo that is to expose oneself to positive associations to a particular group and association."


“We're all biased, but we can put checks in place.”

Individuals can watch documentaries and different types of TV shows and expand their social groups to overcome learned biases, Marks suggested. As for police departments, they can bring implicit bias trainers back for future sessions and follow-up assessments to make sure the information sticks.


Related: Yale Study Finds Signs of Implicit Racial Bias Among Preschool Teachers


"The challenge is in terms of budget. They may not have the budget to bring us back once a month," he said.


Accountability is also crucial. Equipping officers with bodycams and publicly sharing data for how many traffic stops were made by each department by gender, race and neighborhood can help officers pause before acting on impulse.


"We're all biased, but we can put checks in place," Marks said."

ref: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...lice-officers-acting-hidden-prejudice-n656071

Now I understand their are raciest people in the world, and I'm sure things have happened to minorities that were unjust, but that doesn't mean I should apologize for being white - or that I should take a back seat. Personally I don't look at a mans skin color, I look at their character and actions. It's funny you post a quote about people being quick to judge - and then you quickly judge and discount anyone who has difference of opinion instead of trying to understand where that person might be coming from, it's easier to simply close the door on them. I'm not trying to pretend racism doesn't happen, nor am I trying to deny there is a problem. But the door swings both ways. Are you going to try and convince me that if I went to a predominantly black community and walk into the local McDonald's that they will be all happy and joyful to see me and welcome me in? Are you going to tell me any black Officer does not treat white suspects differently?

Well I’m glad you are able to admit and recognize racism still occurs and there is unjust acts committed by the police and in the justice system which is the whole point of topic in this thread. No one asked you to apologize for anything nor take a backseat and again you make accusations as i only pointed out how I was enlightened (or brought to the realization) by the level of discourse people where prepared to have which yes voiced their opinions about NFL players behaving badly but couldn’t recognize nor admit as you have that Police officers and the legal system has been behaving badly as well and lives have been lost which is why people are ‘taking a knee to make a stand for their justice’.

Your comment about you entering into a McDonalds in a Black Community is making what point? Black people welcome white people into their communities all the time and have for decades such as Dylan Booth in the AME church which he turned around and shot up and what about this fun video to watch of this one white girl surrounded by hundreds of Black people in a Black Community.

​

Again your comments and many of the others here show a complete lack of knowledge and facts about Black people in which people like to castigate and categorize as a monolith. Some Black people make statements like the 'whiteman is the devil' which I know some white women would also agree with, or ridiculous claims but we know we can't write the whole entire group of white people and their communities off. Black people have wanted nothing more since coming to America whether ****** into slavery or on their own free will than to be treated fairly and have equal opportunities and see true integration more than White people wanted to see it.

When I grew up in NY I had groups of friends who were White, Black, Asian, Spanish, Indian everything and I never knew any racism nor could recognize what it was and I lived in a predominately Black neighborhood. When I got into High School I mostly hung around predominantly Black and Spanish people but still had white friends both male and female who I treated no different and they came to our neighborhoods and we took especially good care of them when they did as well. I remember one white girl who I was in middle school with who really wanted a hot rap record and you could only get it in the Black neighborhood where yeah you could possibly get robbed. So me and 4 of my boys escorted here all the way from School, took her to the record shop, helped her get the record, and got her back to the train station safely and it was a good 45min ride from school to our hood.

Anyway my point is - don't think you would know how Black people would treat you where you to venture into their 'hood' (good/or bad) cause you don't and people might even end up surprising you pleasantly as well. I know of many people who are not Black who have happened to tell me just that. But bad things do happen as well and I won't deny that and try to say everyone is an Angel but there are Angels every where as I know and I have witnessed that personally.

So far you have done the same, simply projected your personal opinion and said nothing substantive towards moving the discussion forward. So why don't you start? Post clearly what the "real issue" is and what, in your opinion needs to be done to change it. Or, you can simply discount me as a person and my opinion doesn't matter. After all - is that not your goal? Part of eliminating Racism is changing peoples attitudes towards others. Posting what you just did does nothing but drive the wedge further - It tells me you are not open to discussion, but rather Your way or the highway.

Lol, wow so I find it funny and incredible that through-out all of my posts you could miss the points I have made of how the NFL players have their constitutional rights to silently and non-violently protest. Please re-review what I posted before here again for the record:

post 1: I had the 4th post from the beginning of the thread and got 5 likes which is almost as many as any post on this entire thread but I haven't checked all of them. I made the statement: "An injury to one of us is an injury to all of us ... if your not part of the solution then your silence on an issue is compliance and you are part of the problem accepting the status quo.

... To quote James Baldwin "not everything you face can be changed but you can't change things until you face them." And to quote Ghandi "you have to be that change you want to see in the world." Peace to my brother Kapernick for being that lightning rod of change to set it all off, and putting his career and life on the line making the sacrifice. He truly carried a cross, was persecuted..."

Ref: https://www.blacktowhite.net/threads/nfl-kneeling-and-disrespect.109769/page-3#post-1544826

post 2: I defended the Athletes right to protest and was I somewhat opinionated yes but did I tell people they had to agree with 100% of what I said hell no nor would I even think that was something reasonable to ask.

ref: https://www.blacktowhite.net/threads/nfl-kneeling-and-disrespect.109769/#post-1535170

post 3,4,5: Which I highlight what the athletes are peacefully, silently, non-violently, and respectfully doing to include what they are doing off the field like Colin Kap is to help effect change. But this wasn't anything substantive. I laugh cause it was actually one of the most substantive things posted through-out the thread bringing the topic back to the root cause with Colin and what he was doing to put his money where his mouth is (not) in a way cause he never said anything on the field. The media did all the talking beyond the one comment he made in the locker room press conference.

ref: https://www.blacktowhite.net/threads/nfl-kneeling-and-disrespect.109769/page-3#post-1544847

post 6: ******* this was an extremely substantive post I laid out ripping apart Trump's veiled statements and hollow position as he has no moral ground to stand on. Very light on opinion and very heavy on the facts that no one commented or refuted.

ref: https://www.blacktowhite.net/threads/nfl-kneeling-and-disrespect.109769/page-3#post-1544881

After reviewing my prior posts which I provided links to above Its hilarious to try and hurl back my own words against me saying I haven't posted nothing substantive but I wont deflect. Ok - so in answering your call I first laid out the "real issue(s)" along with facts not personal opinions to clear up confusion surrounding issues and some comments that you and others have made.

I am open to discussion hence why I took the time to respond and I haven't been staunch in my personal feelings about the matter just cursing in saying people should stand because its the flag. I've attempted to get people to open their eyes, wake up and change their attitudes with my posts of images, and inspirational quotes. I have no problem admitting Im dismissive of the belittling snark comments as well and will continue to be so.

Now on to solutions and again not so much my opinion but as I first opened the post with here are some Specific, Measurable, Attainable, Realistic, and Timely (S.M.A.R.T.) objectives and goals to address the issue.

We should continue to show solidarity and take a Knee to make a Stand until more people are awoken as to the situation and real change is made and effected in society. Everyone can help the effort in signing ballots, petitioning local elected officials, and Police Commissioners to address the lapses in Proper Police Conduct, and addressing the issues of implicit Police bias as I have pointed out before. People should organize to vote and remove those in office who continue to be injurious to the people's right of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness which are all being taken by the barrel of a gun on an untrained and implicit bias officer.

See my offered solutions continued in the next posting.

 

[BigBlackBull76]

- continued, offered solutions to the Issues I outlined above previous post.



The Des Moines Police Department wants its over 500 employees to be aware of their biases and how they influence their interactions with the community.

That's why the entire department underwent training on implicit bias, provided by Drake University.

The stakes are high: While bias in policing often manifests itself through exasperating if largely unnoticed discrimination, it can also contribute to tragedies, such as high-profile killings of black men by American police officers in recent years.

Laural Clinton, 55, of Des Moines said the Des Moines effort could help abate her worries for her three black sons.

She fears that her children, 14, 20 and 33, will be stopped for the color of their skin — and that one of them could end up dead.

Clinton said she taught her sons not to make any sudden movements if they're in a traffic stop. She told them to always keep their hands visible.

Her middle baby cut his dreadlocks because he doesn't want to catch the attention of the police since he's black, she said.

"Our ******* are barely making it out of routine traffic stops and they’re being shot," Clinton said. "It’s happened way too many times."

Buy Photo
Des Moines Police Academy recruit Brett Vanderpool, 23, of Council Bluffs, listens to Jean Hansen discuss implicit bias at the Des Moines Police Academy. (Photo: Linh Ta/The Register)

Nationwide trend
Everyone is biased.

Our brains create uncontrolled associations known as implicit bias that subconsciously affect our actions, understanding and decisions. There are a variety of influencers, including our environment, community and the media we consume.

This bias comes into play in situations as complex as policing and race or as simple as choosing a grocery store.

"With events in the last few years around the country, implicit bias became a big topic and the need for that," said Des Moines Police Chief Dana Wingert. "In our profession, we feel it’s important to recognize that, so it doesn’t adversely impact how you go about your duties."

Following the shooting death of Michael Brown in Ferguson, Missouri, former President Barack Obama created the President's Task ******* on 21st Century Policing in 2014. In the task *******'s final report, it states implicit bias training as a method of improving officers training quality.

Larger police departments in areas like New York City, Minneapolis, Chicago and San Antonio have undergone implicit bias training.

In Iowa, the Cedar Rapids Police Department had six employees undergo a 'train-the-trainer" implicit bias course, said Greg Buelow, spokesman for the police department. He said the entire department will go through the training.

When Wingert searched for an implicit bias training program last spring, he struggled finding an institution that would offer it, even reaching out to the U.S. Department of Justice.

Buy Photo
Des Moines Police Academy recruits listen as Jean Hansen from Drake University discusses implicit bias at the Des Moines Police Academy. (Photo: Linh Ta/The Register)

But Drake University staff heard about his interest in the course. They offered to craft a program specifically for law enforcement.

How the classes work
The two-hour classes were taught by Scott Law, Drake public safety director, and Brett Niederhauser, assistant director of public safety at Drake.

The classes went from January to February and had about 30 students each at the Des Moines Police Academy.

Attendees took an online assessment to think about their biases.

In an awareness portion, classes saw different images projected on a screen and were asked to share their immediate perceptions.

One picture pulled up was a grainy image of an older white man on a tractor. Attendees said they thought he was elderly with possibly reduced health and may not be as capable because of his age.

The next slide revealed the man was actually U.S. Sen. Chuck Grassley, who runs seven miles a day.

Jean Hansen, Drake's senior online instructional designer for the School of Education, said these exercises break up neural pathways and can help challenge biases.

"By going into counter-typical examples, you start to reform them a little bit," Hansen said.

That was observed with one dispatcher who took the class.

The dispatcher hesitated sending female officers to violent situations — sending their male counterparts instead, Law said.

But when the dispatcher did a ride along with a female officer, she had a realization: Her female colleagues were just as capable at handling these high-stress situations as the male officers.

"Everyone has their own narrative, their own stories that are running," Law said. "It helped everyone start opening up."

The last portion of the session was about mitigation and exploring ways the police employees could challenge implicit bias in their everyday lives.

Law said one officer in the training regularly volunteered at a homeless shelter and realized it challenged his own biases.

"He said it helped him realize he was getting to know those homeless people as people," Law said. "They all have their own story."

Rhonda Rochon, 58, of Des Moines is a black woman interested in community policing. She said it will be mutually positive to create a trusting relationship between officers and people of color.

"The first thing in the first five minutes is you judge someone without knowing a thing about them," Rochon said. "Until you actually communicate with that person, you don’t know their story or what they’re going through. "

Sharon Zanders-Ackiss, a black Des Moines resident and staff member at Iowa Citizens for Communiy Improvement, said people come to them with stories of racial profiling.

For true implicit bias awareness, she said, officers need to make efforts to meet with locals. She said neighborhood association meetings and Coffee with a Cop events aren't representative of the population officers should build rapport with.

“It is time for change. People are living on the edge," Zanders-Ackiss said. "It doesn’t take much for them to jump. We have to figure out how to reel them back in."

Effectiveness of training
Will implicit bias training work when police officers are in high-intensity situations?

Wingert believes it will.

"Once you have that awareness, once it’s in your mind, it can’t help but come into play," he said.

When it comes to life-or-death situations, Law said, officers will need to rely on their implicit bias to make split-second decisions in those moments.

"We need to treat people as individuals, but also remember that sometimes those biases are what keeps us alive," Law said.

Hansen said it was emphasized implicit bias is neither positive or negative.

She said it could be the reason you duck at the right time and save your life. It can also work against you if you're pulling over someone that you assume is safe but is actually a threat.

"You can’t erase implicit bias, but the goal is to mitigate it," Hansen said. "You stop, take a breath if it’s possible, see if it‘s accurate or not and make a decision based off that."

Out of about 21 sessions, Law said he felt 20 of them went well. He said people in one class were not ready to open up as much as other colleagues.

Evaluations conducted before and after the training sessions showed employees gained a better understanding of implicit bias, Hansen said.

Prior to the training, employees were asked to rate their understanding of implicit bias, the usefulness of the training and whether it could increase trust between the police department and the community.

On a 5-point scale, from lowest to highest, most employees were in the middle, with a few in the top and bottom.

A survey at the end, however, had employees ranking more towards the top and a few near the bottom.

"I don’t think we solved every problem, but we absolutely impacted their understanding and ability to see how this could make a difference for them and the police department," Hansen said.

New members of the police department are undergoing implicit bias training through an online course, Hansen said. Drake staff are planning on providing another training session in January — a "level two" course. The next course could include involvement from community members.

"Law enforcement in central Iowa is different than a lot of the things you’re seeing across the country," Wingert said. "But when you keep hearing the importance of implicit bias and how that plays into people going across their daily business, the more you research it, you realize this is something that could have a positive impact in our organization."

To Clinton, the Des Moines mom, continued training will be key for improving relations with the community.

"As long as it’s ongoing — once in a lifetime is not enough," Clinton said. "I don’t think they’re all insensitive. I don’t think they’re all looking for a brawl, but neither are we."

Want to test your implicit bias?
Take the Harvard online test police department employees underwent at implicit.harvard.edu/implicit/takeatest.html.

ref: http://www.desmoinesregister.com/st...eres-how-theyre-trying-mitigate-it/311895001/

The Time to kneel is over, lets stand and then walk the talk to really take action on this cause.

And to show that I can listen to the other side - yes lets stand for the Anthem, show pride and respect for our Country once we feel our grievances have are being addressed and eventually again and continue to take real action off the field and make a difference.



TWEETLINKEDIN 15 COMMENTEMAILMORE
It can’t end with a knee.

That only was the beginning.

The white-hot controversy that stemmed from NFL players kneeling during the national anthem has cooled down.

“Your protests have been heard,” former NFL commissioner Paul Tagliabue said Tuesday night at the University of Michigan. “Now, move on to actions.”

But what was heard, exactly? Some heard an alarm about social injustice; others saw a lack of patriotism. Our country is still divided. Nothing has really changed and that makes the next stage even more important than the initial protest. To keep the issue out in front. To try to make real progress.

Several college and professional sports teams from Michigan are trying to do that, in different ways, while sparking constructive dialogue about social injustices. You can see it on the warm-up T-shirts the Michigan State basketball team has been wearing, and how the Michigan football players have remained locked arm-in-arm during the national anthem, and in the words written by Pistons coach Stan Van Gundy.

Current University of Michigan Athletic Director Warde Manuel, former NFL commissioner Paul Tagliabue and former U-M athletic director Jim Hackett talk during an event at the University of Michigan (Photo: David Jesse)

“People should never be permitted to feel comfortable while trampling the rights of others,” Van Gundy wrote in an insightful essay for Time magazine, which went online on Tuesday.

Listening key to understanding
The Michigan State basketball team played Duke on Tuesday night on national TV. During warm-ups, the Spartans wore T-shirts that read: “We Talk, We Listen.”

It was not a protest.

It was a reminder to keep the conversation going.

“Of course there is injustice in the world,” MSU basketball star Miles Bridges said earlier this month. “We don’t want to be silent.”

This MSU basketball team is a melting pot of different races, different backgrounds, different religions, different experiences. Most college teams are. And the players have had long talks about their experiences, trying to understand one another.

“One thing we all agreed on is there are social injustices,” MSU coach Tom Izzo told reporters a few weeks ago, when he revealed the meaning of the T-shirts. “There is so much divisiveness in our country… We felt there are too many people talking and not enough people listening.”

Izzo has started the conversation on his own team and is trying to use his platform to spread it to the public, treading carefully so the message is not lost.

“Doing nothing doesn’t help,” Izzo said. “We are not trying to capture a moment. We are trying to create a movement.”

Michigan State's Miles Bridges, right, and Xavier Tillman warm up on Friday, Nov. 10, 2017, at Breslin Center. (Photo: Al Goldis, AP)

When the controversy over player kneeling during the national anthem peaked earlier this fall, Michigan athletic director Warde Manuel sent a letter to all of the U-M student athletes. He wanted to make sure each player understood the issue fully before they started protesting.

Since then, the U-M football players have continued to lock arms during the national anthem.

“I’m very proud of the way they are handling it,” Manuel said on Tuesday.
In his next breath, Manuel said this is just the beginning.

“It’s not enough to make a symbolic statement,” Manuel said. “Then it becomes, the now what? There are many solutions. There are multiple ways of approaching a problem.”

He, too, believes getting people to talk about the issues is the first step. But talking isn’t the problem. Listening is more important than anything, on both sides.

“We have to be willing to listen and to hear what we may not want to hear and to be comfortable that it may not change our minds right away, but we are developing a deeper understanding from a different perspective,” he said. “Go into the community. Have connections and understandings.”

It's time for us to stand up
On Tuesday morning, Time published the essay written by Van Gundy, which laid out the next steps.

The headline was juicy: “Athletes Who Protest Are Patriots.”

But if you dig into the essay, the message was far more nuanced.

“What is it that they want?” Van Gundy wrote, about the protesters. “Simply and succinctly: equality. Equal rights. Equal justice. Equal treatment by police and others in authority. Equal opportunity. The second sentence of the Declaration of Independence starts with, “We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal.” In over two centuries, from slavery to segregation to lynchings and police ******* to the mass incarceration of people of color, we have not even come close to that ideal. It is our systemic racial inequality, not athletes kneeling during the national anthem, that dishonors our country.

"If we truly want to honor our country, this must change.”

Van Gundy laid out several potential changes:

“Ameliorating harsh sentencing guidelines and ending mandatory minimum sentences…. While people of color make up less than 40% of the U.S. population, they currently make up 67% of the prison population." ...

“Enacting clean slate laws.” ...

“Eliminating cash bail. Holding people presumed to be innocent in jail pre-trial simply because they cannot afford to pay their bail extracts huge human and financial costs. It costs taxpayers $38 million a day and $14 billion a year.” ...

“Reforming juvenile justice. As of 2015, states are five times more likely to lock up black ******* in a juvenile facility than white *******… In Wayne County — which includes Detroit — we have the second-largest concentration of people sentenced to die in jail as *******, and 92% of them are black.” ...

“Ending police ******* and racial bias in police departments. This was the issue that started the current player protests. The athletes have been urging police departments to change and modernize their hiring practices and training in order to reduce racial bias among officers.”

Buy Photo
Pistons head coach Stan Van Gundy talked with reporters about the upcoming season Sept. 25, 2017 at the Palace in Auburn Hills. (Photo: Kirthmon F. Dozier, Detroit Free Press)

Van Gundy should be applauded for taking a stand, for being a leader on this issue.
This controversy never was about the flag. It’s about the meaning behind that flag, or what that flag should represent. It should stand for equality, equal in the eyes of the law, equal in how we treat each other. That flag should stand for the freedom to disagree, the freedom to speak out, the freedom to protest.

That flag should stand for non-violent protest.

But most of all, that flag should represent each one of us, the same way. No matter your color. Or religion. Or sexual orientation. Or anything.

“It’s important for us to talk about it every day until it resonates, until change happens,” Van Gundy wrote.

The time for taking a knee is over.

Now, it’s time for everybody to stand up and do something, until that flag wraps around each one of us, the same way.

Contact Jeff Seidel: jseidel@freepress.com. Follow him on Twitter @seideljeff. To read his recent columns, go to freep.com/sports/jeff-seidel/

ref: http://www.freep.com/story/sports/c...2017/11/16/stan-van-gundy-tom-izzo/867169001/

 

[hoping hubby]

Best song I've heard in years! Take a knee...My ASS!

 

[subhub174014]

The Des Moines Police Department wants its over 500 employees to be aware of their biases and how they influence their interactions with the community.

that's BS put out by Iowa.....the Polk County Jail is larger than most state prisons....Iowa is a police state!
check the population numbers vs the prison numbers one of the highest in the country
you go to jail there you are charged $63.00 per night...goes against whatever property you own or taxes you may draw
city of Des Moines has 44 suv's they park around the city...usually in areas where there might be a bar...they park them on the curb...they have camera's front and rear..for speeders and etc...most stop light and speed limit signs have cameras

not arguing your point there bigblackbull....just arguing the Des Moines article and how I see it there...I visit my brother a few times a year...and usually when I get home within a week or so I get some kind of ticket in the mail..red light/speeding...
any article stating Iowa is working towards improvements is just propaganda...last I saw they were in the top 5 in the nation for number of prisoners!

 

[TwoBiFour]

Issue 1: Social injustice - wrongful deaths, no justice brought against the innocent lives that were murdered.

I'll agree that this is the primary issue, and I noticed you didn't specify a color as it's not color specific.

Issue 2: Colin Kapernick bravely and heroically ‘taking a knee’ to take stand for Real Justice

Bravely - maybe, Heroically - I disagree. This isn't an "issue", it's your opinion. If you want to idolize Colin, be my guest - don't expect everyone else to.

Issue 3: The right of the players to protest by kneeling during the National Anthem and as being a patriotic act

No one here (at least I'm not) is saying that it's not there right to take a knee, just that some don't agree with it. And they don't half to agree, because that is part of what freedom is.

Issue 4: Claims and the false narrative that what the NFL players are doing is offensive to the Military or Police

It's not a false narrative, I know several officers and military that do in fact take an offense to it.

Issue 5: Trump’s inaccurate, ignominious, and pompous statements about NFL players and their cause being as an offensive to the Military and Law Enforcement.

Trumps opinion is irrelevant to me, so number 1 becomes really the only issue, the rest are your view points.

I appreciate you bringing up the question on what are some solutions. These are not my opinions as I do my homework and can rely on facts so here wold be some Specific, Measurable, Attainable, Realistic, and Timely objectives and goals to address the issue.

And I appreciate you taking the time to respond - However there is a measurable amount if miss understandings here that I would like to clarify and I will ignore your passive aggressive stabs at my level of education and intelligence.

But now you want to twist and put words in my mouth with the claim I said or imply that “the system is racist”. I only stated there are inequalities in our society, I NEVER made the statement the “racist system” or the "system is racist"

My apologies, that was my assumption, and I am glad to hear that you do not agree. There are several black community leaders in my area that continually preach this even though it is clear that there are individuals within the system that are racist. But instead of targeting those individuals, they want more laws that give more benefits to blacks specifically, which isn't going to solve anything.

and how naive can you be to bring up the constitution when not only all of the writers of the document kept Black people in ****** servitude (slavery) during the writing but it also contained a statement that blacks were only counted as 3/5s to equal every white person in the southern states and had no rights to vote.

And yet they had the presence of mind to state "ALL MEN" (that includes blacks by the way) are created equal. Yes they had slaves, but if they truly believed they were only 3/5's as equal, the constitution would have stated as such - but it didn't. So I don't believe this is a valid argument.

Now although I never made the charge about the ‘System being racist’ I accept your challenge to point how several laws which have been legally acknowledged and struck down in this country that specifically singled out Black people:

If we agree that the system isn't inherently racist, then why are you trying to show me that it its? As you pointed out, these laws were struck down showing once again that our constitution protected the rights of "all men" and didn't single anyone out, black white or otherwise.

Black people created their own programs to provide recognition where and when they weren’t getting recognition from main-stream America.

You are a smart man - I think you know exactly what I was getting at in this section. I know the "why", My point was that all these groups and many more are allowed by LAW to exclude whites, any public group that would try to exclude blacks as a rule would be labeled racist and brought up on hate charges.

So your DAM right Black people felt the need to organize their own programs to raise funding for college educations but whats so wrong with that with the UNCF?

And there is nothing wrong with the UNCF except that they are allowed by law to be a racist group. Can you imagine the protesting anyone would face if they tried to create a UWCF?

My point is that if you want equality - then lets make it equal - no more special privileges and that means no more black history month. No - the rest of the year is not "white history". That's nothing more than a false justification.

Your comment about you entering into a McDonalds in a Black Community is making what point?

That there is racism on both sides. I my self do not expect to be treated differently no matter where I am, nor do I treat anyone else different based on skin color. My point was that you can't convince me there is no blank on white racism.

Black people welcome white people into their communities all the time and have for decades

And so have whites welcomed blacks.

Lol, wow so I find it funny and incredible that through-out all of my posts you could miss the points I have made of how the NFL players have their constitutional rights to silently and non-violently protest. Please re-review what I posted before here again for the record:

And again, I never said they don't have the right to protest in this manner. So not sure where that came from. I simply don't agree that doing so during the anthem is the proper way.

So to conclude;
I agree there is injustices within our justice systems, but I don't think it is strictly a black on white issue.
I agree that more/better training within our police departments is needed. As well as investigations into judges that continually sentence blacks with more time than a white guy for the same crime.
I understand the reasons behind the protesting - While I recognize their right to do so, I don't agree that taking a knee during the anthem is the appropriate method.
I don't believe the "system is inherently racist" and from what you posted it appears you don't think so either, that was my mistaken assumption.
However I also feel that all the special programs that single out whites need to to either dissolve, or start to include all races. Affirmative actions (or special treatment) only breeds resentments and reinforces hate instead of alleviating it.