Convention of States

TwoBiFour

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IN, US

Whats everyone thoughts?
Is this a waste of time and money or is it a viable whole or partial solution?

Note, Trolls will be ignored. Civil discourse only.
 
The COS process has never been used. However, the first ten amendments ratified under Article V are none other than The Bill of Rights -- that's a pretty good track record. Of the 27 amendments ratified over 200+ years only the 18th Prohibition of Alcohol, turned out badly. It was then repealed by the 21st, which is the only amendment that resembled a COS process.

The COS does place power in the citizens and although a long shot for success, it should throw fear into the state's legislatures and spur them to act. It also appears to be favored mostly by conservative states and severely limits the power of populated states such as California (each state gets one vote).

Presently the greatest danger to the Constitution is the democrat demands for the "popular vote", which would utterly destroy our constitutional process and the country as we know it. If the dems push popular vote hard enough, our process could devolve into civil war.
 
Presently the greatest danger to the Constitution is the democrat demands for the "popular vote", which would utterly destroy our constitutional process and the country as we know it. If the dems push popular vote hard enough, our process could devolve into civil war.
The electoral college was implemented for two reasons. In 2016 it failed its first function proving that it is an outdated concept.

The first reason that the founders created the Electoral College was due to the fear of direct election to the Presidency. They were concerned a tyrant could manipulate public opinion and come to power. Hamilton wrote in the Federalist Papers:

It was equally desirable, that the immediate election should be made by men most capable of analyzing the qualities adapted to the station, and acting under circumstances favorable to deliberation, and to a judicious combination of all the reasons and inducements which were proper to govern their choice. A small number of persons, selected by their fellow-citizens from the general mass, will be most likely to possess the information and discernment requisite to such complicated investigations. It was also peculiarly desirable to afford as little opportunity as possible to tumult and disorder. This evil was not least to be dreaded in the election of a magistrate, who was to have so important an agency in the administration of the government as the President of the United States. But the precautions which have been so happily concerted in the system under consideration, promise an effectual security against this mischief.

Hamilton and the other founders believed that the electors would be able to ensure that only a qualified person becomes President. They thought that with the Electoral College no one would be able to manipulate the citizenry. It would act as a check on an electorate that might be duped. Hamilton and the other founders did not trust the population to make the right choice. The founders also believed that the Electoral College had the advantage of being a group that met only once and thus could not be manipulated over time by foreign governments or others.
 
I will post it again.

Hamilton and the other founders believed that the electors would be able to ensure that only a qualified person becomes President. They thought that with the Electoral College no one would be able to manipulate the citizenry. It would act as a check on an electorate that might be duped. Hamilton and the other founders did not trust the population to make the right choice. The founders also believed that the Electoral College had the advantage of being a group that met only once and thus could not be manipulated over time by foreign governments or others
 
The electoral college was implemented for two reasons. In 2016 it failed its first function proving that it is an outdated concept.

The first reason that the founders created the Electoral College was due to the fear of direct election to the Presidency. They were concerned a tyrant could manipulate public opinion and come to power. Hamilton wrote in the Federalist Papers:

It was equally desirable, that the immediate election should be made by men most capable of analyzing the qualities adapted to the station, and acting under circumstances favorable to deliberation, and to a judicious combination of all the reasons and inducements which were proper to govern their choice. A small number of persons, selected by their fellow-citizens from the general mass, will be most likely to possess the information and discernment requisite to such complicated investigations. It was also peculiarly desirable to afford as little opportunity as possible to tumult and disorder. This evil was not least to be dreaded in the election of a magistrate, who was to have so important an agency in the administration of the government as the President of the United States. But the precautions which have been so happily concerted in the system under consideration, promise an effectual security against this mischief.

Hamilton and the other founders believed that the electors would be able to ensure that only a qualified person becomes President. They thought that with the Electoral College no one would be able to manipulate the citizenry. It would act as a check on an electorate that might be duped. Hamilton and the other founders did not trust the population to make the right choice. The founders also believed that the Electoral College had the advantage of being a group that met only once and thus could not be manipulated over time by foreign governments or others.

You should include the link where you copy and paste from
 
It didn't prevent a horribly unqualified candidate from ascending to the presidency.
I hope you can someday understand that the rigorous Constitutional vetting process by which America selects presidents, as finalized by the Electoral College, is how we establish that the winner is qualified to be President.

Because your feelings are not facts.

This is why democrats go out after election day, and scream at the sky.
 
Federalist #39 clearly spells out the primary purpose of the electoral college...that being to make the selection of the President and his power come from a combination of the people and the states, just as Congressional power is derived. (i.e. the House power is apportioned based on the population with each state getting a number of delegates based on the number of people in the state while the Senate power is apportioned equally among states with each state getting two Senators.) The founders thought this was an appropriate way to balance power in the Republican government between the people of the nation and the states. They wanted and created the same balance of power for the Presidential selection as they did with Congressional selection.

Federalist #39

The next relation is, to the sources from which the ordinary powers of government are to be derived. The House of Representatives will derive its powers from the people of America; and the people will be represented in the same proportion, and on the same principle, as they are in the legislature of a particular State. So far the government is NATIONAL, not FEDERAL. The Senate, on the other hand, will derive its powers from the States, as political and coequal societies; and these will be represented on the principle of equality in the Senate, as they now are in the existing Congress. So far the government is FEDERAL, not NATIONAL. The executive power will be derived from a very compound source. The immediate election of the President is to be made by the States in their political characters. The votes allotted to them are in a compound ratio, which considers them partly as distinct and coequal societies, partly as unequal members of the same society. The eventual election, again, is to be made by that branch of the legislature which consists of the national representatives; but in this particular act they are to be thrown into the form of individual delegations, from so many distinct and coequal bodies politic. From this aspect of the government it appears to be of a mixed character, presenting at least as many FEDERAL as NATIONAL features.

http://avalon.law.yale.edu/18th_century/fed39.asp

As to the thread topic, I believe this is a case where one should be careful what they wish for....they might get it. A constitutional convention would be an effective way to address areas of the Constitution which sorely need addressing....things like placing clear bounds on the interstate commerce clause which is grossly abused by the Federal government to stick its nose into areas where it has no authority by any reasonable reading of the constitution. We could also address items like adding term limits.

However, a constitutional convention opens up the whole can of worms....Depending on the whims of the delegates, you could wind up with them changing items you don't want changed. Do you like the 1st amendment...the 2nd amendment? There's no guarantees those protections survive at all or unadulterated. Given the shockingly poor civics education these days, many people have no real understanding of the concepts and reasoning behind the governmental system our founders created....as well evidenced by many in this forum!
 
I hope you can someday understand that the rigorous Constitutional vetting process by which America selects presidents, as finalized by the Electoral College, is how we establish that the winner is qualified to be President.

Because your feelings are not facts.

This is why democrats go out after election day, and scream at the sky.
Rigorous vetting process? Donald Trump was rigorously vetted? ??????
 
Federalist #39 clearly spells out the primary purpose of the electoral college...that being to make the selection of the President and his power come from a combination of the people and the states, just as Congressional power is derived. (i.e. the House power is apportioned based on the population with each state getting a number of delegates based on the number of people in the state while the Senate power is apportioned equally among states with each state getting two Senators.) The founders thought this was an appropriate way to balance power in the Republican government between the people of the nation and the states. They wanted and created the same balance of power for the Presidential selection as they did with Congressional selection.

Federalist #39

The next relation is, to the sources from which the ordinary powers of government are to be derived. The House of Representatives will derive its powers from the people of America; and the people will be represented in the same proportion, and on the same principle, as they are in the legislature of a particular State. So far the government is NATIONAL, not FEDERAL. The Senate, on the other hand, will derive its powers from the States, as political and coequal societies; and these will be represented on the principle of equality in the Senate, as they now are in the existing Congress. So far the government is FEDERAL, not NATIONAL. The executive power will be derived from a very compound source. The immediate election of the President is to be made by the States in their political characters. The votes allotted to them are in a compound ratio, which considers them partly as distinct and coequal societies, partly as unequal members of the same society. The eventual election, again, is to be made by that branch of the legislature which consists of the national representatives; but in this particular act they are to be thrown into the form of individual delegations, from so many distinct and coequal bodies politic. From this aspect of the government it appears to be of a mixed character, presenting at least as many FEDERAL as NATIONAL features.

http://avalon.law.yale.edu/18th_century/fed39.asp

As to the thread topic, I believe this is a case where one should be careful what they wish for....they might get it. A constitutional convention would be an effective way to address areas of the Constitution which sorely need addressing....things like placing clear bounds on the interstate commerce clause which is grossly abused by the Federal government to stick its nose into areas where it has no authority by any reasonable reading of the constitution. We could also address items like adding term limits.

However, a constitutional convention opens up the whole can of worms....Depending on the whims of the delegates, you could wind up with them changing items you don't want changed. Do you like the 1st amendment...the 2nd amendment? There's no guarantees those protections survive at all or unadulterated. Given the shockingly poor civics education these days, many people have no real understanding of the concepts and reasoning behind the governmental system our founders created....as well evidenced by many in this forum!
That wasn't "the primary reason." There were 2 reasons and I already addressed the failed reason. I do happen to agree with the thought of equal representation though.
 
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